Brimstone Headhunters

[JACKAL]

This incident below was posted on Facebook last night, just an FYI on making sure you have proper permits and or don't fall for this racketeering scheme by Mike Love the owner of Brimstone. Just saying, they are not law enforcement, they don't know who you are unless you tell them.


So guys had a bad experience this weekend on my first trip to Brimstone. We had a group of 13 people and met up with another group of 7 on the trails, stayed at Trails End Camp Ground (No complaints at Trails End they are great people) bought a Brimstone pass at about noon on Friday, only bought the 1 day. We rode all afternoon until 2AM and had a blast. The next day Saturday we decided that we would run the TWRA trails and see the abandon train, we did not buy a Brimstone pass because we had no intentions of riding Brimstone. We are all new to this area, we usually ride in WV so we are basically just following a GPS with some maps we had purchased to guide us to where we need to go, we end up at an intersection and there are two guys standing there that waive us down, its Brimstone workers checking for passes. We explain that we are heading to the train car and we had bought TWRA passes for the day and didn't mean to be on Brimstone, he tells us that we are on Brimstone property and that we are all going to have to pay for a permit and pay a $30 fine, that equals out to $61 each ($1220 for the group). We explained that we had bought a pass the day before and showed them to them but they scanned and said they were no good only good until Midnight of the day you purchase. The guy we were talking to was just a guy doing his job he said he could not make any decisions about waiving this so I asked to talk to his boss so we could explain. I ended up talking to a guy named Mark something I believe he is the owner, pleaded my case that it was an honest mistake and we had bought passes the day before but decided to run TWRA that day and did not intend to be on his property. That guy is a total Dick! First question he asked is where I was staying, as soon as I said Trails End basically the conversation was over. I am not a guy that tries to cheat and not pay for riding, I go to WV every year and pay my money for Hatfield permit even though I ride outlaws trails the whole time because I want these places to stay open. He had his entrapment area at the intersection he did for one reason only making money, otherwise he would set up where his property started and not an intersection in off state property.
Sorry for the long rant but want everybody to be aware of this so it doesn't happen to them, the trail marking down there is very confusing and some trails are shared Brimstone/TWRA trails and either permit would allow you to ride these. The Mark guy that I talked to, not sure if he was the actual owner or just some Asshole that works for him but he can kiss my Ass! I will be back at Tails End to stay with them again and will ride TWRA trails but will not give Brimstone another dime of my money!!

 

[dnjones161]

This incident below was posted on Facebook last night, just an FYI on making sure you have proper permits and or don't fall for this racketeering scheme by Mike Love the owner of Brimstone. Just saying, they are not law enforcement, they don't know who you are unless you tell them.


So guys had a bad experience this weekend on my first trip to Brimstone. We had a group of 13 people and met up with another group of 7 on the trails, stayed at Trails End Camp Ground (No complaints at Trails End they are great people) bought a Brimstone pass at about noon on Friday, only bought the 1 day. We rode all afternoon until 2AM and had a blast. The next day Saturday we decided that we would run the TWRA trails and see the abandon train, we did not buy a Brimstone pass because we had no intentions of riding Brimstone. We are all new to this area, we usually ride in WV so we are basically just following a GPS with some maps we had purchased to guide us to where we need to go, we end up at an intersection and there are two guys standing there that waive us down, its Brimstone workers checking for passes. We explain that we are heading to the train car and we had bought TWRA passes for the day and didn't mean to be on Brimstone, he tells us that we are on Brimstone property and that we are all going to have to pay for a permit and pay a $30 fine, that equals out to $61 each ($1220 for the group). We explained that we had bought a pass the day before and showed them to them but they scanned and said they were no good only good until Midnight of the day you purchase. The guy we were talking to was just a guy doing his job he said he could not make any decisions about waiving this so I asked to talk to his boss so we could explain. I ended up talking to a guy named Mark something I believe he is the owner, pleaded my case that it was an honest mistake and we had bought passes the day before but decided to run TWRA that day and did not intend to be on his property. That guy is a total Dick! First question he asked is where I was staying, as soon as I said Trails End basically the conversation was over. I am not a guy that tries to cheat and not pay for riding, I go to WV every year and pay my money for Hatfield permit even though I ride outlaws trails the whole time because I want these places to stay open. He had his entrapment area at the intersection he did for one reason only making money, otherwise he would set up where his property started and not an intersection in off state property.
Sorry for the long rant but want everybody to be aware of this so it doesn't happen to them, the trail marking down there is very confusing and some trails are shared Brimstone/TWRA trails and either permit would allow you to ride these. The Mark guy that I talked to, not sure if he was the actual owner or just some Asshole that works for him but he can kiss my Ass! I will be back at Tails End to stay with them again and will ride TWRA trails but will not give Brimstone another dime of my money!!

I'll say this: one of the biggest barriers that's kept us from riding Tennessee is the permitting process. The states website isn't very clear at ALL on what is needed and where that allows you to ride.

We've stuck in WV for that reason.

 

[JACKAL]

I'll say this: one of the biggest barriers that's kept us from riding Tennessee is the permitting process. The states website isn't very clear at ALL on what is needed and where that allows you to ride.

We've stuck in WV for that reason.

I will agree that it is confusing and not clearly indicated for general public reading. People just want to buy a pass and ride not go through 6 pages of regulations then still interpret what they need to buy.

In Eastern TN there is 3 areas all run together in a 1.5 million acre area of trails:

Brimstone- 50k acre private off road park must stay at thier accommodations and buy thier trail permits. Adjoins TWRA New River and Royal Blue on their western borders. Been in a fued with family ran Trails End campground since 2012 instigated by Mike Love owner of Brimstone purely out of greed, why he initiated must stay on Brimstone property to ride Brimstone property in 2012.

Windrock- 70k acre private off road park must buy thier permits. Adjoins Royal Blue and New River on thier southern and southeast borders.

TWRA - 300,000+ acres of WMA land with trails. Need one of the following permit or combinations:

Purchase Riding Permits here: Tennessee TWRA License

Only one permit per vehicle is required, not per person like the private parks.

NOTE: Annual Permits are from March 1st through February 28th the following year.

TN Residents:
PER DAY: TYPE 36 Cost $18.00 > This is called a High Impact permit.
ANNUAL PASS: TYPE 1 & TYPE 93 Cost $56.00 > Annual Hunt Fish License / WMA Small Game
JUNIOR RESIDENT ANNUAL: (Ages 13-15) TYPE 2 & TYPE 94 Cost $35.00

NON RESIDENTS:
PER DAY: TYPE 38 Cost $40.00 > This is called a High Impact permit.
7 DAY PASS: TYPE 93 & TYPE 72 Cost $84.00 > Non Resident Non Big Game 7 Day Hunt Fish License / WMA Small Game
ANNUAL PASS: Type 71 & TYPE 93 Cost $133.00 > > Non Resident Non Big Game Hunt Fish License / WMA Small Game

JUNIOR NON-RESIDENT ANNUAL: (Ages 13-15) TYPE 70 & TYPE 94 Cost $36.00

Children 12 and under do not require any permits even if operating their own machine.

 

[ohanacreek]

This incident below was posted on Facebook last night, just an FYI on making sure you have proper permits and or don't fall for this racketeering scheme by Mike Love the owner of Brimstone. Just saying, they are not law enforcement, they don't know who you are unless you tell them.


So guys had a bad experience this weekend on my first trip to Brimstone. We had a group of 13 people and met up with another group of 7 on the trails, stayed at Trails End Camp Ground (No complaints at Trails End they are great people) bought a Brimstone pass at about noon on Friday, only bought the 1 day. We rode all afternoon until 2AM and had a blast. The next day Saturday we decided that we would run the TWRA trails and see the abandon train, we did not buy a Brimstone pass because we had no intentions of riding Brimstone. We are all new to this area, we usually ride in WV so we are basically just following a GPS with some maps we had purchased to guide us to where we need to go, we end up at an intersection and there are two guys standing there that waive us down, its Brimstone workers checking for passes. We explain that we are heading to the train car and we had bought TWRA passes for the day and didn't mean to be on Brimstone, he tells us that we are on Brimstone property and that we are all going to have to pay for a permit and pay a $30 fine, that equals out to $61 each ($1220 for the group). We explained that we had bought a pass the day before and showed them to them but they scanned and said they were no good only good until Midnight of the day you purchase. The guy we were talking to was just a guy doing his job he said he could not make any decisions about waiving this so I asked to talk to his boss so we could explain. I ended up talking to a guy named Mark something I believe he is the owner, pleaded my case that it was an honest mistake and we had bought passes the day before but decided to run TWRA that day and did not intend to be on his property. That guy is a total Dick! First question he asked is where I was staying, as soon as I said Trails End basically the conversation was over. I am not a guy that tries to cheat and not pay for riding, I go to WV every year and pay my money for Hatfield permit even though I ride outlaws trails the whole time because I want these places to stay open. He had his entrapment area at the intersection he did for one reason only making money, otherwise he would set up where his property started and not an intersection in off state property.
Sorry for the long rant but want everybody to be aware of this so it doesn't happen to them, the trail marking down there is very confusing and some trails are shared Brimstone/TWRA trails and either permit would allow you to ride these. The Mark guy that I talked to, not sure if he was the actual owner or just some Asshole that works for him but he can kiss my Ass! I will be back at Tails End to stay with them again and will ride TWRA trails but will not give Brimstone another dime of my money!!

What gets me is TWRA charges you $140/yr for a permit

Brimstone and Windrock want that for 2Days!!!

The trails aren’t any better!!!

 

[Choogsbro]

I will agree that it is confusing and not clearly indicated for general public reading. People just want to buy a pass and ride not go through 6 pages of regulations then still interpret what they need to buy.

In Eastern TN there is 3 areas all run together in a 1.5 million acre area of trails:

Brimstone- 50k acre private off road park must stay at thier accommodations and buy thier trail permits. Adjoins TWRA New River and Royal Blue on their western borders. Been in a fued with family ran Trails End campground since 2012 instigated by Mike Love owner of Brimstone purely out of greed, why he initiated must stay on Brimstone property to ride Brimstone property in 2012.

Windrock- 70k acre private off road park must buy thier permits. Adjoins Royal Blue and New River on thier southern and southeast borders.

TWRA - 300,000+ acres of WMA land with trails. Need on of the following permit or combinations:

Purchase Riding Permits here: Tennessee TWRA License

Only one permit per vehicle is required, not per person like the private parks.

TN Residents:
PER DAY: TYPE 36 Cost $18.00
ANNUAL PASS: TYPE 1 & TYPE 93 Cost $56.00
JUNIOR RESIDENT ANNUAL: (Ages 13-15) TYPE 2 & TYPE 94 Cost $35.00

NON RESIDENTS:
PER DAY: TYPE 38 Cost $40.00
7 DAY PASS: TYPE 93 & TYPE 72 Cost $84.00
ANNUAL PASS: Type 71 & TYPE 93 Cost $133.00

JUNIOR NON-RESIDENT ANNUAL: (Ages 13-15) TYPE 70 & TYPE 94 Cost $36.00

Children 12 and under do not require any permits even if operating their own machine.

Pretty much sums it up. Sad part is now this man has a bad taste in his mouth about TN trail riding all because of ML. Hope he does return to ride the TWRA trails because they really do have a lot to offer.

 

[dnjones161]

I will agree that it is confusing and not clearly indicated for general public reading. People just want to buy a pass and ride not go through 6 pages of regulations then still interpret what they need to buy.

In Eastern TN there is 3 areas all run together in a 1.5 million acre area of trails:

Brimstone- 50k acre private off road park must stay at thier accommodations and buy thier trail permits. Adjoins TWRA New River and Royal Blue on their western borders. Been in a fued with family ran Trails End campground since 2012 instigated by Mike Love owner of Brimstone purely out of greed, why he initiated must stay on Brimstone property to ride Brimstone property in 2012.

Windrock- 70k acre private off road park must buy thier permits. Adjoins Royal Blue and New River on thier southern and southeast borders.

TWRA - 300,000+ acres of WMA land with trails. Need on of the following permit or combinations:

Purchase Riding Permits here: Tennessee TWRA License

Only one permit per vehicle is required, not per person like the private parks.

TN Residents:
PER DAY: TYPE 36 Cost $18.00
ANNUAL PASS: TYPE 1 & TYPE 93 Cost $56.00
JUNIOR RESIDENT ANNUAL: (Ages 13-15) TYPE 2 & TYPE 94 Cost $35.00

NON RESIDENTS:
PER DAY: TYPE 38 Cost $40.00
7 DAY PASS: TYPE 93 & TYPE 72 Cost $84.00
ANNUAL PASS: Type 71 & TYPE 93 Cost $133.00

JUNIOR NON-RESIDENT ANNUAL: (Ages 13-15) TYPE 70 & TYPE 94 Cost $36.00

Children 12 and under do not require any permits even if operating their own machine.

I'm not going to lie- this is the kind of well thought out, detailed response I was hoping that comment would prompt

Thank you for clarifying!

One more question since you seem to be so knowledgeable on the topic... Are the passes for the state ground January 1 to December 31?

 

[JACKAL]

I'll say this: one of the biggest barriers that's kept us from riding Tennessee is the permitting process. The states website isn't very clear at ALL on what is needed and where that allows you to ride.

We've stuck in WV for that reason.

If you ever want to give East TN a try call me up (I am usually on site TH-SU each week) at any of our 3 campgrounds all phone numbers come to one location, ususally only me (Bob) or Stepahanie take incoming calls:
Ride Royal Blue
The Ridges at Royal Blue
Eagle Rock Resort & Campground

I will be glad to help you with the licensing and borders. One of the easiest ways to know where you are riding is the Lifetime Trail Maps app or Tablet, it has all the private offroad parks trails clearly marked that run seemlessly into and out of TWRA property.
The thre campgrounds above are all about 2 hrs by trail East and North of the private off road parks.

 

[JACKAL]

I'm not going to lie- this is the kind of well thought out, detailed response I was hoping that comment would prompt

Thank you for clarifying!

One more question since you seem to be so knowledgeable on the topic... Are the passes for the state ground January 1 to December 31?

Annual TN Permits run from March 1st to the end of February the following year.

 

[Choogsbro]

If you ever want to give East TN a try call me up at any of out 3 campgrounds all phone numbers come to one location, ususally only me (Bob) or Stepahanie take incoming calls:
Ride Royal Blue
The Ridges at Royal Blue
Eagle Rock Resort & Campground

I will be glad to help you with the licensing and borders. One of the easiest ways to know where you are riding is the Lifetime Trail Maps app or Tablet, it has all the private offroad parks trails clearly marked that run seemlessly into and out of TWRA property.
The thre campgrounds above are all about 2 hrs by trail East and North of the private off road parks.

Bob, Stephanie, PJ and the whole staff at RRB are awesome. All the campgrounds are great also. The Ridges is my absolute favorite. Give them a try you won't be sorry and you WILL come back.

 

[dnjones161]

If you ever want to give East TN a try call me up (I am usually on site TH-SU each week) at any of our 3 campgrounds all phone numbers come to one location, ususally only me (Bob) or Stepahanie take incoming calls:
Ride Royal Blue
The Ridges at Royal Blue
Eagle Rock Resort & Campground

I will be glad to help you with the licensing and borders. One of the easiest ways to know where you are riding is the Lifetime Trail Maps app or Tablet, it has all the private offroad parks trails clearly marked that run seemlessly into and out of TWRA property.
The thre campgrounds above are all about 2 hrs by trail East and North of the private off road parks.

Much appreciated I will definitely do this. I would imagine we will wait until the spring at this point...try to get the most bang for our buck. We ride 4-5 times a year, and it sounds like there's plenty of east Tennessee to make a few trips on one year's permit.

 

[JACKAL]

Much appreciated I will definitely do this. I would imagine we will wait until the spring at this point...try to get the most bang for our buck. We ride 4-5 times a year, and it sounds like there's plenty of east Tennessee to make a few trips on one year's permit.

Well then just come see us all at the 6th annual 2020 HONDASXS.COM Pioneer Takeover, dates to be announced likely late April early May. This club sold out 85% of all three campgrounds for 2019.

2019 Pioneer Takeover - May 3&4th - Ride Royal Blue, TN.

 

[Chooglin]

Well then just come see us all at the 6th annual 2020 HONDASXS.COM Pioneer Takeover, dates to be announced likely late April early May. This club sold out 85% of all three campgrounds for 2019.

2019 Pioneer Takeover - May 3&4th - Ride Royal Blue, TN.

This is a must do, good people and great riding!

 

[NTCPrezJB]

Appreciate the insight. I will definitely look this up to remind me which riding park to skip when I visit the area.

 

[DG Rider]

Not that it affects me now, but...
After reading this...seems like I recall reading quite a bit about the owner of Brimstone and his antics. Wasn't he accused of padding the pockets of local politicians in an attempt to get rid of his competition, or am I thinking of someone else?

 

[dnjones161]

Well then just come see us all at the 6th annual 2020 HONDASXS.COM Pioneer Takeover, dates to be announced likely late April early May. This club sold out 85% of all three campgrounds for 2019.

2019 Pioneer Takeover - May 3&4th - Ride Royal Blue, TN.

That's the plan! We missed this year because of a graduation but I'm looking forward to checking it out in 2020. I've really enjoyed the forum during my last year of ownership. Great guys and a wealth of information.

 

[Ragnar406]

This incident below was posted on Facebook last night, just an FYI on making sure you have proper permits and or don't fall for this racketeering scheme by Mike Love the owner of Brimstone. Just saying, they are not law enforcement, they don't know who you are unless you tell them.


So guys had a bad experience this weekend on my first trip to Brimstone. We had a group of 13 people and met up with another group of 7 on the trails, stayed at Trails End Camp Ground (No complaints at Trails End they are great people) bought a Brimstone pass at about noon on Friday, only bought the 1 day. We rode all afternoon until 2AM and had a blast. The next day Saturday we decided that we would run the TWRA trails and see the abandon train, we did not buy a Brimstone pass because we had no intentions of riding Brimstone. We are all new to this area, we usually ride in WV so we are basically just following a GPS with some maps we had purchased to guide us to where we need to go, we end up at an intersection and there are two guys standing there that waive us down, its Brimstone workers checking for passes. We explain that we are heading to the train car and we had bought TWRA passes for the day and didn't mean to be on Brimstone, he tells us that we are on Brimstone property and that we are all going to have to pay for a permit and pay a $30 fine, that equals out to $61 each ($1220 for the group). We explained that we had bought a pass the day before and showed them to them but they scanned and said they were no good only good until Midnight of the day you purchase. The guy we were talking to was just a guy doing his job he said he could not make any decisions about waiving this so I asked to talk to his boss so we could explain. I ended up talking to a guy named Mark something I believe he is the owner, pleaded my case that it was an honest mistake and we had bought passes the day before but decided to run TWRA that day and did not intend to be on his property. That guy is a total Dick! First question he asked is where I was staying, as soon as I said Trails End basically the conversation was over. I am not a guy that tries to cheat and not pay for riding, I go to WV every year and pay my money for Hatfield permit even though I ride outlaws trails the whole time because I want these places to stay open. He had his entrapment area at the intersection he did for one reason only making money, otherwise he would set up where his property started and not an intersection in off state property.
Sorry for the long rant but want everybody to be aware of this so it doesn't happen to them, the trail marking down there is very confusing and some trails are shared Brimstone/TWRA trails and either permit would allow you to ride these. The Mark guy that I talked to, not sure if he was the actual owner or just some Asshole that works for him but he can kiss my Ass! I will be back at Tails End to stay with them again and will ride TWRA trails but will not give Brimstone another dime of my money!!

@JACKAL - so were they on Brimstone trails or were they on trails that are shared between Brimstone and TWRA - I was a little unclear on that part.... You think it was a true scam (not associated with Brimstone) or if it was the Brimstone owner on the phone being an A$$.
Jackass move all around - thanks for posting

 

[Choogsbro]

I would say it is true based on the past feud with Trails End who are by the way awesome.

 

[JACKAL]

Not that it affects me now, but...
After reading this...seems like I recall reading quite a bit about the owner of Brimstone and his antics. Wasn't he accused of padding the pockets of local politicians in an attempt to get rid of his competition, or am I thinking of someone else?

Very Long bitter story, in detail on another forum going back 6+ years, readers digest version yes to what you said & he is now a local politician too. Anyhoo the worst part had LEO's targeting riders in Huntsville during a big Bstone Paragon event nearly 300 tickets issued in 3 days mostly to people who were staying at the competing family campground mentioned in original post. Anyway it has been a mess and had thought it was history, apparently not. At least the State Police got smart and figured out they were being used as a billy club a few years back.

Just like profiling based upon a persons skin color or ethnic appearance, LEO were quick to queue in on who had a Paragon attendance bracelet and who didn't. Depending on that appearance seemed to determine who got a pass or a ticket.

 

[Russ989]

This is a must do, good people and great riding!

Got that right!

 

[BigOL3]

Annual TN Permits run from March 1st to the end of February the following year.

Let me say up front ...... I may be totally WRONG ..... but, I bought a yearly turkey hunting lic back in May, and it is my understanding it is good for a year from the date of purchase. That said, it was also my understanding it covered riding the govt trails for that same year ..... not ending in Feb????