P700 Oil consumption

[Mnjr]

So last year at this time I posted how I was going thru oil between changes, about a quart every 150 miles with only 4200 miles on it. I had a lot of non believers. My dealer was very rude stating these are nothing but lawn mower engines, all makes do it, it needs a top end, etc.
Now at 4794 miles I changed the oil again as I do every 600 miles. Also changed the plugs. I am posting pictures of the plugs. My service contract would not assist. Honda Corp would not assist. Never swamped. Never rode hard. Ride between 2 farms checking cattle daily. Gravel and clay roads. Is anyone else experiencing this?

 

[Admin]

 

[JACKAL]

Definitely not normal. I serviced a 2014 P700 earlier this year with over 4200 miles on it. Had NEVER had the oil changed or air filter cleaned.

Only reason I worked on it was owner said couldn't climb hill at lake house. Fully serviced it, had to replace air filter it was so bad and had less than 1 qt oil in it keeping transmission from running correctly.

After working on it, ran it 100 miles no oil use ran like it should. It of any P700 should have died.

To your issue, it may have the bad camshaft issue, possibly caused valve seal wear and burning oil through there. Also if air filter is contaminated/ dirty engine can suck oil from crankcase vent, through air filter into intake.

Need a dealer with a proper mechanic and no opinion until correctly diagnosed.

Here is my thread with pictures of the P700 I worked on:

Multi - Please don't do this to your Honda

So a fella who has a couple of Pioneers asked me to look at one. A 2014 Pioneer 700-4 describes the issue as it won't climb the hill at his lake house. Told him I would pick it up and check it out. So today I wasn't busy and decided to see what's going on with it. Fired right up took it 300...

hondasxs.com

 

[tjoreo]

Before my current 1000 I had a 2015 700. One thing I did often was replace and service the air filter. With the air intake mid machine I found it sucked in alot of dust within 200 to 300 miles. We live in the desert of southern Idaho so like you alot of dry dusty roads. Even after these few hundred miles the filter was very dirty and I had heard of people dusting out there motor without servicing the air filter. I had a set of 3 that I would run. 1 in the machine, 1 ready to be put on and 1 I needed to clean up. Hopefully a good oil change and new plugs will be the cure but something definitely to watch. The air intake up front was one of the key selling points for my 1000 upgrade.

 

[Mnjr]

Before my current 1000 I had a 2015 700. One thing I did often was replace and service the air filter. With the air intake mid machine I found it sucked in a lot of dust within 200 to 300 miles. We live in the desert of southern Idaho so like you alot of dry dusty roads. Even after these few hundred miles the filter was very dirty and I had heard of people dusting out there motor without servicing the air filter. I had a set of 3 that I would run. 1 in the machine, 1 ready to be put on and 1 I needed to clean up. Hopefully a good oil change and new plugs will be the cure but something definitely to watch. The air intake up front was one of the key selling points for my 1000 upgrade.

I'm hoping a new air filter will help. I thought I had another but I didn't so I ordered one yesterday after changing the oil. I always changed it with the oil change. It has just under 600 miles on it now. No smoke out the exhaust either. No leaks at all. I can't see it needing engine work so soon. Of all the Honda products I've owned over the years this is a first. I still have 2 four wheelers with 1900 and 2400 miles. Never used a drop. Those have been ridden way harder than the Pioneer 700.

 

[TOGR]

Any chance you have been too nice to it? Maybe rings not fully seated plus some carbon? Curious what would happen if you wringed it out for a bit.

 

[Jerryg]

Excessive oil consumption is not normal. The only way to accurately judge the reason for the oil consumption is to disassemble the engine and do some failure analysis. Although unfortunate, if the machine is in otherwise good condition, it is worth it.

You don't want to just keep letting the oil get low, at that point the engine may be un-rebuildable.

And be sure the cause is fully understood, so it doesn't happen twice.

 

[Mnjr]

Any chance you have been too nice to it? Maybe rings not fully seated plus some carbon? Curious what would happen if you wringed it out for a bit.

What's funny is my buddy bought one after seeing mine. Mine is a 2016 and his a 2017. He would go on 60 mile rides, sink in mud, slid of a bridge into a raging river over his head. I had to winch him out. He changed the oil twice. Pulled the plug he could get to and cranked it over. Put the plug back in. He started using oil about 2000 miles ago. It has almost 12,000 miles on it. Still the original plug up top. I think you're right. I should have beat on it.

 

[Jerryg]

What's funny is my buddy bought one after seeing mine. Mine is a 2016 and his a 2017. He would go on 60 mile rides, sink in mud, slid of a bridge into a raging river over his head. I had to winch him out. He changed the oil twice. Pulled the plug he could get to and cranked it over. Put the plug back in. He started using oil about 2000 miles ago. It has almost 12,000 miles on it. Still the original plug up top. I think you're right. I should have beat on it.

I don't think that is your issue, there is no real break-in procedure for that engine. The problem is most likely not the rings unless there has been serious dirt ingestion. In my 30 years of Honda Engine experience, I have seen one oil ring failure.

 

[tjoreo]

I'm hoping a new air filter will help. I thought I had another but I didn't so I ordered one yesterday after changing the oil. I always changed it with the oil change. It has just under 600 miles on it now. No smoke out the exhaust either. No leaks at all. I can't see it needing engine work so soon. Of all the Honda products I've owned over the years this is a first. I still have 2 four wheelers with 1900 and 2400 miles. Never used a drop. Those have been ridden way harder than the Pioneer 700.

I found that the 700 was a way different beast when it came to air filters. I relate it to the dust ingestion behind the passenger seat. I have an older 03 Foreman that has about 11000 miles on it and can count on one hand how many times I serviced the air filter. Someone I know said their boy had one of the early 700 and had engine trouble because of neglecting the air filter. After I checked it the first time and saw how filthy it was I just got in the habit of cleaning it every 200 miles. Hopefully it is something easy as the filter but I'm afraid with the way the plugs look it is something more indepth. I can't remember when ordering the filter if it was pre oiled, but I'm guessing you are making sure it is oiled up? I also ask if you are using the right filter oil as a local guy toasted his old arctic cat atv by using the wrong oil. Hopefully you can get it figured out, because they really are nice machines. I sold mine to a cousin with 4800 miles and last I now he was about 7000 miles on it.

 

[Mnjr]

I found that the 700 was a way different beast when it came to air filters. I relate it to the dust ingestion behind the passenger seat. I have an older 03 Foreman that has about 11000 miles on it and can count on one hand how many times I serviced the air filter. Someone I know said their boy had one of the early 700 and had engine trouble because of neglecting the air filter. After I checked it the first time and saw how filthy it was I just got in the habit of cleaning it every 200 miles. Hopefully it is something easy as the filter but I'm afraid with the way the plugs look it is something more indepth. I can't remember when ordering the filter if it was pre oiled, but I'm guessing you are making sure it is oiled up? I also ask if you are using the right filter oil as a local guy toasted his old arctic cat atv by using the wrong oil. Hopefully you can get it figured out, because they really are nice machines. I sold mine to a cousin with 4800 miles and last I now he was about 7000 miles on it.

I'm using Honda Gn4 10w30 and Honda filters from day one

 

[TOGR]

Sounds like you have been pretty easy on it, going back and forth between your farms. It does get over a few thousand RPM's sometimes, right? Was not the oil ring I was concerned about.

 

[Mnjr]

Sounds like you have been pretty easy on it, going back and forth between your farms. It does get over a few thousand RPM's sometimes, right? Was not the oil ring I was concerned about.

I would take it up to 35 mph sometimes. I never beat it that's for sure.

 

[Jerryg]

Is there or is there not a break-in procedure with that engine? If not, it didn't matter how easy you were with it.

 

[Mnjr]

Is there or is there not a break-in procedure with that engine? If not, it didn't matter how easy you were with it.

I changed the oil after the first 100 miles then every 500-600 miles after.

 

[Jerryg]

I changed the oil after the first 100 miles then every 500-600 miles after.

If that is what the manual says to to then, you did what you were supposed to do.

Unless the manual says something about breaking in the engine, there is no such procedure necessary.

 

[TOGR]

Rings seat best with varying RPM and heat, often in cycles, and over some period of time depending on the motor and the motor's intended use. There are many theories/approaches to the best method, but regardless of what camp one is in, I would think most would agree virtually all engines benefit from a break in procedure. For instance, you wouldn't want to just idle around forever.

 

[Jerryg]

If it is true that the rings didn't seat, and you did what the manual says to do, then Honda will be paying for the repair.

But I doubt that is the case.

 

[Mnjr]

If it is true that the rings didn't seat, and you did what the manual says to do, then Honda will be paying for the repair.

But I doubt that is the case.

It's out of warranty. I tried asking for assistance. They passed. I'll get it fixed but not by my dealer. I will find someone reputable and capable. It just sucks. Of all my Honda cars, motorcycles, outboard motors, and 4 wheelers, this is my first let down.

 

[Jerryg]

It's out of warranty. I tried asking for assistance. They passed. I'll get it fixed but not by my dealer. I will find someone reputable and capable. It just sucks. Of all my Honda cars, motorcycles, outboard motors, and 4 wheelers, this is my first let down.

It's hard to ask Honda for help when you don't know the cause of the failure. It's either Honda's fault or your fault.

If the cause of failure is lack of lubrication, it's your responsibility. If it's a manufacturing defect, it's Honda's responsibility. After the conclusion of failure analysis, if you still think it is Honda's responsibility, take them to court.

 

[TOGR]

No smoke and no leaks--have you run a compression check on it?

After being serviced, does it run correctly?

When changing the air filters, did you ever notice the "clean side" of the airbox being dusty?

Have you checked all clamps and connections between the air filter and the motor?

Ever see any metal or anything unusual in the oil?

Anything unusual regarding the fuel you use?

It is a real mystery given 1) how meticulously you have maintained it, and 2) it is a Honda. Please report back when you find the cause.