Talon Performance Mods

[Passio]

I would like to see what are the best upgrades to achieve more power without adding the turbo. I've searched around but haven't found legitimate info on power increases from exhaust and tunes and whether doing these upgrades are even worth it. I'm guessing an exhaust and tune would add roughly 10hp and can I do this without voiding the warranty and is 10hp even worth the $. I like the Trinity exhaust set-up with the tune if I decided to go this route. Thoughts?

 

[PaulF]

I would like to see what are the best upgrades to achieve more power without adding the turbo. I've searched around but haven't found legitimate info on power increases from exhaust and tunes and whether doing these upgrades are even worth it. I'm guessing an exhaust and tune would add roughly 10hp and can I do this without voiding the warranty and is 10hp even worth the $. I like the Trinity exhaust set-up with the tune if I decided to go this route. Thoughts?

All the HP claims are bulls***. None of them are worth the money when considering HP gains, especially at your altitude. Maybe closer to sea level the gains are better but up near the 5K level, they just don't make all that much difference.

Don't get me wrong, I have the HMF full exhaust and LOVE the look and sound and it did add some power but it didn't add anywhere near the power claimed. All marketing hype.

If I had to do it all again, I would go with a slip on for a better sound and save some $$$.

 

[Alan_Vander]

Until people are actually dyno tuning them and reading active fuel maps. The plug and play is gonna be trashy. For example not everybike will perform the same. Altitude. Tire size height weight rim weight . Plug and play might give you 1-3% gain at best. Where a good dyno tune with your setup and altitude could give you 10% easy

Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk

 

[Passio]

Thanks for the advice. Maybe holding off for a little would be best. The lack of power during hill climbs is killing me while I watch all these CanAms fly right up them and here I am having to back down time after time again. Maybe just doing the OEM turbo is something I really need to consider. If anyone else has it already, please tell me what you think. Thanks

 

[TripleB]

Thanks for the advice. Maybe holding off for a little would be best. The lack of power during hill climbs is killing me while I watch all these CanAms fly right up them and here I am having to back down time after time again. Maybe just doing the OEM turbo is something I really need to consider. If anyone else has it already, please tell me what you think. Thanks

Do those other machines making the hill climbs have a turbo?

 

[PaulF]

Thanks for the advice. Maybe holding off for a little would be best. The lack of power during hill climbs is killing me while I watch all these CanAms fly right up them and here I am having to back down time after time again. Maybe just doing the OEM turbo is something I really need to consider. If anyone else has it already, please tell me what you think. Thanks

Need a little more info (like type of surface, tires, conditions) to offer any advice but I can tell you...

1) The Talon does not shift correctly in soft ground like sand. If you are not manually shifting under these conditions, the spinning wheels will confuse the ECU and the DCT will upshift you out of your power range and you will stall out (even in Sport mode). Try manually shifting and see what happens. If it is real steep, try Low range and keep the engine in it's sweet spot (about 6,000 to 8,000 RPM).

2) Tires need to be correct for the terrain. For instance, if you are in sand and the other machines have paddles and you don't then you are comparing apples to oranges.

3) Try using 4WD. Many won't use it because it robs HP. That is true BUT while it robs some HP, under certain conditions it puts 2 or 3 times what it robs back to the ground through the front tires so you get a net gain. It doesn't always work but most time it does.

After trying the above and you are still experiencing that drastic of a difference then these machines are well above the power a stock Talon is capable of. Most CanAm sport machines are rated starting at 120 HP. They are slightly heavier than the Talon so you should be able to keep up with them OK. The ones blowing your doors off are rated at either 172 or 195 HP. With custom tunes on turbo machines like that it is fairly easy to push the 195 models to 220 HP, more than twice what the Talon has.

In any case, you will not compete with the higher HP Turbo machines, no matter who or how you tune your machine. If you want to compete with the X3 Turbos on the occasional hill climb, you need a turbo. A full exhaust and tune will not get you even close and you will be sorely disappointed so save your money and buy a Turbo.

One of my riding partners just installed the Turbo on his R and (weather permitting) we are going out this weekend. He said I could take it for a spin so I will let you know what I feel. We are going to the Dunes so it will be a good test because the dunes we go to are packed with X3 Turbos and RZR Turbos. There is a 700 foot hill climb that a stock Talon with paddles can do but like you, the X3 Turbos blow right past. This will be a good test, especially at the 5200 foot level where we will be.

 

[Passio]

They are turbo machines.

 

[Passio]

Need a little more info (like type of surface, tires, conditions) to offer any advice but I can tell you...

1) The Talon does not shift correctly in soft ground like sand. If you are not manually shifting under these conditions, the spinning wheels will confuse the ECU and the DCT will upshift you out of your power range and you will stall out (even in Sport mode). Try manually shifting and see what happens. If it is real steep, try Low range and keep the engine in it's sweet spot (about 6,000 to 8,000 RPM).

2) Tires need to be correct for the terrain. For instance, if you are in sand and the other machines have paddles and you don't then you are comparing apples to oranges.

3) Try using 4WD. Many won't use it because it robs HP. That is true BUT while it robs some HP, under certain conditions it puts 2 or 3 times what it robs back to the ground through the front tires so you get a net gain. It doesn't always work but most time it does.

After trying the above and you are still experiencing that drastic of a difference then these machines are well above the power a stock Talon is capable of. Most CanAm sport machines are rated starting at 120 HP. They are slightly heavier than the Talon so you should be able to keep up with them OK. The ones blowing your doors off are rated at either 172 or 195 HP. With custom tunes on turbo machines like that it is fairly easy to push the 195 models to 220 HP, more than twice what the Talon has.

In any case, you will not compete with the higher HP Turbo machines, no matter who or how you tune your machine. If you want to compete with the X3 Turbos on the occasional hill climb, you need a turbo. A full exhaust and tune will not get you even close and you will be sorely disappointed so save your money and buy a Turbo.

One of my riding partners just installed the Turbo on his R and (weather permitting) we are going out this weekend. He said I could take it for a spin so I will let you know what I feel. We are going to the Dunes so it will be a good test because the dunes we go to are packed with X3 Turbos and RZR Turbos. There is a 700 foot hill climb that a stock Talon with paddles can do but like you, the X3 Turbos blow right past. This will be a good test, especially at the 5200 foot level where we will be.

Thanks for the feedback. We do all types of terrain here in Colorado and the experience I am specifically talking about is in loose sand(dune area). I tried all ways of driving up some of these hills and yes, manual is the only way but even with lower psi in the stock tires I still couldn't maintain enough momentum with enough power to clear the peak. My friend drives the X3 172hp turbo and man that thing rips. With all that power and torque, he didn't struggle once. I get we are comparing an NA talon to a turbo machine so like you said, it's not apples to apples. I guess if I'm looking for some serious hill climbing, I will stick to my Yamaha Banshee (the king of hill climbing). Keep me posted on your experience with the turbo talon.

 

[PaulF]

Thanks for the feedback. We do all types of terrain here in Colorado and the experience I am specifically talking about is in loose sand(dune area). I tried all ways of driving up some of these hills and yes, manual is the only way but even with lower psi in the stock tires I still couldn't maintain enough momentum with enough power to clear the peak. My friend drives the X3 172hp turbo and man that thing rips. With all that power and torque, he didn't struggle once. I get we are comparing an NA talon to a turbo machine so like you said, it's not apples to apples. I guess if I'm looking for some serious hill climbing, I will stick to my Yamaha Banshee (the king of hill climbing). Keep me posted on your experience with the turbo talon.

1) Tires make a HUGE difference. You must have the correct tire to have the desired outcome. Stock Talon tires are HORRIBLE in the sand. I have some cheap paddles and they are far better than stock and get me where I want to go. The other Talon in our group has Scat Trak Extremes (expensive) and he goes many places I can't (this is even before the turbo). I climb a hill 2/3 the way and dig in/stall out and he goes all the way up with ease. He now has a Turbo so I will no longer be able to compare anything we do anymore.
2) If you compare the Talon to other N/A machines with similar tire for the given environment, you will find the Talon VERY competitive. I have yet to be embarrassed (or even really beat for that matter) by a N/A RZR, KRX, YXZ, etc. yet. All the current similar N/A machines are basically neck in neck as far as I have experienced. If you want to keep up with the turbo machines, you will need to get a turbo

 

[Passio]

1) Tires make a HUGE difference. You must have the correct tire to have the desired outcome. Stock Talon tires are HORRIBLE in the sand. I have some cheap paddles and they are far better than stock and get me where I want to go. The other Talon in our group has Scat Trak Extremes (expensive) and he goes many places I can't (this is even before the turbo). I climb a hill 2/3 the way and dig in/stall out and he goes all the way up with ease. He now has a Turbo so I will no longer be able to compare anything we do anymore.
2) If you compare the Talon to other N/A machines with similar tire for the given environment, you will find the Talon VERY competitive. I have yet to be embarrassed (or even really beat for that matter) by a N/A RZR, KRX, YXZ, etc. yet. All the current similar N/A machines are basically neck in neck as far as I have experienced. If you want to keep up with the turbo machines, you will need to get a turbo

100% agree. Have you tried adjusting the stock suspension at all? We all know how the back end bucks and it would be nice to see if I could do some adjustments to soften it up a little with spending the money. I did read that someone loosened the tender spring and it helped. What do you think?

 

[PaulF]

100% agree. Have you tried adjusting the stock suspension at all? We all know how the back end bucks and it would be nice to see if I could do some adjustments to soften it up a little with spending the money. I did read that someone loosened the tender spring and it helped. What do you think?

Absolutely loosen up the crossover rings. Go as far as you can without causing the tender springs to coil bind. I believe you can go as much as 25 turns in the rear but do 10 turns at a time and see how it does. You can check coil bind by measurement or just put some zip ties in a couple places on the coils. If the zip ties get cut, you went too far. That is what I did before I changed my springs and it helped a lot.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

Company on FB porting the head and larger cam.

"Chris Fowler

Head and cam package is $1600 with ECU flash. If you have a Dynojet PowerVision already its $1500 total just send your PV when you send you head and cam in. Package includes Launch Control."

25 RWHP. Your going to give up some bottom end, so big tires and rock crawling probably wouldn't be good with this but sand would be great.

 

[Smith]

Where in CO do you ride? Im looking at getting a Talon this year and im up in northern CO. Would love to find some open desert and sand but im assuming id have to go out to the western slope or way down south.

 

[PaulF]

Keep me posted on your experience with the turbo talon.

Turbo Talon was a no-go this past weekend. Turbo was running fine but by the time I got there he was having trouble with a Long Travel Kit he had installed so the machine was down

He will get it fixed and we will go out again soon.

 

[Passio]

Where in CO do you ride? Im looking at getting a Talon this year and im up in northern CO. Would love to find some open desert and sand but im assuming id have to go out to the western slope or way down south.

I live in the Denver area. As far as riding goes in CO, it's mostly trails but a good mix of wide and fast, slow and crawly. The only spot that I've been to that is an open sand pit area is North Sand Hills Recreation area in Walden. It's actually one of my favorite places in CO to ride. Other great places I like are Rainbow Falls, Green Mountain, Terryall/Jefferson, Taylor Park and Grand Lake area. I haven't played too much on the west side which has many great spots as well but if I'm making a four hour drive west then it's just worth an extra two and go to Moab.

 

[Passio]

Turbo Talon was a no-go this past weekend. Turbo was running fine but by the time I got there he was having trouble with a Long Travel Kit he had installed so the machine was down

He will get it fixed and we will go out again soon.

Thanks for the update. Looking forward to hearing your opinion on it. Back to the suspension discussion, you said to loosen up the crossover rings. I'm not to familiar with tuning so do you lower or raise the rings to soften it up?

 

[PaulF]

Thanks for the update. Looking forward to hearing your opinion on it. Back to the suspension discussion, you said to loosen up the crossover rings. I'm not to familiar with tuning so do you lower or raise the rings to soften it up?

Raise them.

 

[Smith]

I live in the Denver area. As far as riding goes in CO, it's mostly trails but a good mix of wide and fast, slow and crawly. The only spot that I've been to that is an open sand pit area is North Sand Hills Recreation area in Walden. It's actually one of my favorite places in CO to ride. Other great places I like are Rainbow Falls, Green Mountain, Terryall/Jefferson, Taylor Park and Grand Lake area. I haven't played too much on the west side which has many great spots as well but if I'm making a four hour drive west then it's just worth an extra two and go to Moab.

Thanks for the info! North sand hills looks pretty sweet but seems like youd run out of room real quick. Does it feel as small as it looks on paper? Ya , it makes sense to just make the little bit longer journey to moab if you're already makin that trek. Its a bummer we dont have a good size OHV area in the plains east / NE of Denver. Sorry to hijack your thread but dont see to many CO folks on here. Good luck in your quest for more power!

 

[ALBANATE]

The ECU in the Talon is actually quite complex and has not only barometric compensation but oxygen sensor input and correction. The loss from elevation will be there in stock form, so with a tune and say a pipe nearly the same amount of gains will be seen. Can you benefit from doing an individual dyno tune at your elevation... ? sure, but a tune developed down at sea level will still benefit you at elevation. I do agree that a tune not developed on a dyno is always going to be lacking, but hopefully you do your due diligence and purchase from one of us reputable companies that uses a dyno to develop our products. I personally have hundreds of dyno pulls in our shop Talon developing not only the ECU tune, but also different exhaust components, intake parts and mods, and cam packages. There is 100% noticeable power gains available in the the NA Talon platform.

Nate
Alba Racing

 

[Passio]

Raise them.

The ECU in the Talon is actually quite complex and has not only barometric compensation but oxygen sensor input and correction. The loss from elevation will be there in stock form, so with a tune and say a pipe nearly the same amount of gains will be seen. Can you benefit from doing an individual dyno tune at your elevation... ? sure, but a tune developed down at sea level will still benefit you at elevation. I do agree that a tune not developed on a dyno is always going to be lacking, but hopefully you do your due diligence and purchase from one of us reputable companies that uses a dyno to develop our products. I personally have hundreds of dyno pulls in our shop Talon developing not only the ECU tune, but also different exhaust components, intake parts and mods, and cam packages. There is 100% noticeable power gains available in the the NA Talon platform.

Nate
Alba Racing

Thanks for the info Nate. I am a fan of Alba Racing. I just put a set of your a-arms on my Banshee and they have performed very well. I would be open to minor upgrades like you mentioned but I wouldn't do any if it voids my factory warranty. If you have more information on theses mods and if they don't void the warranty, I'm all ears. Proof on paper that the power increase with your mods at my elevation would absolutely be enticing. Let me know where I can find documentation and pricing.