Multi I don't think I'll be using new Honda air filters as delivered anymore.

[DG Rider]

So this topic has actually taken a month or 2 to complete, with pretty definitive results. At least for those of us with foam filters.

Like many of you, I keep an extra air filter ready to go. It's well known that genuine Honda filters come pre-oiled. I ran the extra new one as delivered from honda...as I usually do, but I think I will stop this practice due to something I noticed with my 1st 700, but didn't get an opportunity to repeat conditions to confirm until an accidental tear in my OEM filter forced another out of the box use back to back with my own oiled unit.

This is the as-delivered filter after running until it needed cleaning:

And my intake tract. That line is where I rubbed my finger in the dust:

After snapping this pic, I cleaned out the boot with a wet rag so we could start fresh.

This is one that I serviced with maxima FFT. Note that this oil is dark blue, so it looks worse than it is (though it's bad enough!):

And the intake tract, again with a finger mark:

As you can see, there is virtually no dust in the boot this time. One of these CLEARLY does a better job of stopping dust.

I don't know if its because the pre-oiled filter doesn't seem to have an excess of oil, or if the oil itself isn't as effective, but any new filters I buy from Honda from now on will be getting serviced BEFORE they go in.

 

[Admin]

 

[Backwoods]

So this topic has actually taken a month or 2 to complete, with pretty definitive results. At least for those of us with foam filters.

Like many of you, I keep an extra air filter ready to go. It's well known that genuine Honda filters come pre-oiled. I ran the extra new one as delivered from honda...as I usually do, but I think I will stop this practice due to something I noticed with my 1st 700, but didn't get an opportunity to repeat conditions to confirm until an accidental tear in my OEM filter forced another out of the box use back to back with my own oiled unit.

This is the as-delivered filter after running until it needed cleaning:

View attachment 271324

And my intake tract. That line is where I rubbed my finger in the dust:

View attachment 271325

After snapping this pic, I cleaned out the boot with a wet rag so we could start fresh.

This is one that I serviced with maxima FFT. Note that this oil is dark blue, so it looks worse than it is (though it's bad enough!):

View attachment 271327

And the intake tract, again with a finger mark:

View attachment 271328

As you can see, there is virtually no dust in the boot this time. One of these CLEARLY does a better job of stopping dust.

I don't know if its because the pre-oiled filter doesn't seem to have an excess of oil, or if the oil itself isn't as effective, but any new filters I buy from Honda from now on will be getting serviced BEFORE they go in.

I oil mine before use if its a new one with PJ1 they don't have enough Oil on them.

 

[lee]

If you get a service part foam filter oil it before use.

 

[Bmurray]

put grease or Vaseline around the filter mount at each change

 

[DG Rider]

put grease or Vaseline around the filter mount at each change

I know on some stuff you do this, but The 700/500 setup uses a clamp, so it's not necessary for them.

 

[Bmurray]

I know on some stuff you do this, but The 700/500 setup uses a clamp, so it's not necessary for them.

All of my bikes, atv's and sxs we do and have done this. just a small amount. there's never a perfect seal and when you change the filter it'll grab the dust at the removal.

 

[DG Rider]

All of my bikes, atv's and sxs we do and have done this. just a small amount. there's never a perfect seal and when you change the filter it'll grab the dust at the removal.

The seal is perfect, trust me. No need for it here.

 

[Fischer]

So this topic has actually taken a month or 2 to complete, with pretty definitive results. At least for those of us with foam filters.

Like many of you, I keep an extra air filter ready to go. It's well known that genuine Honda filters come pre-oiled. I ran the extra new one as delivered from honda...as I usually do, but I think I will stop this practice due to something I noticed with my 1st 700, but didn't get an opportunity to repeat conditions to confirm until an accidental tear in my OEM filter forced another out of the box use back to back with my own oiled unit.

This is the as-delivered filter after running until it needed cleaning:

View attachment 271324

And my intake tract. That line is where I rubbed my finger in the dust:

View attachment 271325

After snapping this pic, I cleaned out the boot with a wet rag so we could start fresh.

This is one that I serviced with maxima FFT. Note that this oil is dark blue, so it looks worse than it is (though it's bad enough!):

View attachment 271327

And the intake tract, again with a finger mark:

View attachment 271328

As you can see, there is virtually no dust in the boot this time. One of these CLEARLY does a better job of stopping dust.

I don't know if its because the pre-oiled filter doesn't seem to have an excess of oil, or if the oil itself isn't as effective, but any new filters I buy from Honda from now on will be getting serviced BEFORE they go in.

Is that a pioneer 500? My intake looks different.

 

[CID]

Is that a pioneer 500? My intake looks different.

No, he’s riding a 700.

 

[Fischer]

So this topic has actually taken a month or 2 to complete, with pretty definitive results. At least for those of us with foam filters.

Like many of you, I keep an extra air filter ready to go. It's well known that genuine Honda filters come pre-oiled. I ran the extra new one as delivered from honda...as I usually do, but I think I will stop this practice due to something I noticed with my 1st 700, but didn't get an opportunity to repeat conditions to confirm until an accidental tear in my OEM filter forced another out of the box use back to back with my own oiled unit.

This is the as-delivered filter after running until it needed cleaning:

View attachment 271324

And my intake tract. That line is where I rubbed my finger in the dust:

View attachment 271325

After snapping this pic, I cleaned out the boot with a wet rag so we could start fresh.

This is one that I serviced with maxima FFT. Note that this oil is dark blue, so it looks worse than it is (though it's bad enough!):

View attachment 271327

And the intake tract, again with a finger mark:

View attachment 271328

As you can see, there is virtually no dust in the boot this time. One of these CLEARLY does a better job of stopping dust.

I don't know if its because the pre-oiled filter doesn't seem to have an excess of oil, or if the oil itself isn't as effective, but any new filters I buy from Honda from now on will be getting serviced BEFORE they go in.

Are you going to just add more oil to whats on the new filter or wash the new and then oil it?

 

[Farmer]

Just picking your brain from another angle....and I've seen this question arise with K&N type filters.... Is it possible that the stock Honda filter comes over oiled and the excess gets drawn in and sticks to the intake, therefore causing the fine dust to appear/stick to the intake??? VS a situation where dust actually gets in but doesn't stick to or appear on the intake?

I mean, how do you even know if your filter is protecting your 700 from covid if you can't see the particles...LOL!

 

[lee]

@Farmer are you running 2 filters on your SxS?
I think the CDC says you don’t have to anymore.

I’ve seen guys use a rag to wipe oil on to the inner surface of the rubber intake to see if particles are getting past the filter.
But the issue seams to be a lack of oil on service parts foam filters.
No idea when or why this changed but that’s not how I remember it from back in the day.

 

[DG Rider]

Is that a pioneer 500? My intake looks different.

As @CID said. I'm a 700, but the 500 uses virtually the same filter and clamping set up.

Are you going to just add more oil to whats on the new filter or wash the new and then oil it?

I would clean and re-oil it. Don't know how 2 different oils would react to each other...and I have doubts about the oil that is coming on the filters. See below...

Just picking your brain from another angle....and I've seen this question arise with K&N type filters.... Is it possible that the stock Honda filter comes over oiled and the excess gets drawn in and sticks to the intake, therefore causing the fine dust to appear/stick to the intake??? VS a situation where dust actually gets in but doesn't stick to or appear on the intake?

I mean, how do you even know if your filter is protecting your 700 from covid if you can't see the particles...LOL!

If over oiling the filter caused dust collect in the intake, the one I did would have a ton of it. I'm more from the school of oil the s*** out of the thing and let it drip dry. I do this in a bag and then pour the leftover back into the bottle I'm using.

When you get the filter from Honda it's actually kind of hard to tell it has any oil on it. If you wipe it you get a little stuff on your finger or a paper towel that seems more like baby oil. I believe Honda service manuals recommend pouring x amount of oil in a bag and working it in the filter. I'd have to go look that up as for the amount, but I remember being surprised at how little it was. As I said above that's not how I go about it.

I will confess that I'm not 100% convinced that it's all the amount of oil on the filter from Honda. If you pour some of the fft above...Or any of a number of aftermarket foam filter oils, you'll see that they are super tacky and hard to clean off.
Many, many years ago I bought a bottle of Honda pro filter oil, and it was one of the best as far as that goes. It was literally like snot or that slime we used to get as a kid. It would stick to anything, so it was easy to see how it would stop dirt and dust.
Whatever comes on the new filters is definitely not that. Someone said that the oil that comes on them now is from no toil. I believe one of no toil's big selling points is that it's biodegradable and can be cleaned with water, IE GREEN.
I'm all for being environmentally friendly, but I'm more interested in stuff that actually works. And often I find those two things don't exist together. My wife asks me if I want the "green" insecticide or something. My reply is no, I'd rather have something with harsh chemicals that actually works. And I wonder if the same thing isn't going on here.
I see people talking about cleaning their filter with soapy water on here all the time. There's not the slightest chance in the deepest basement of hell that you're going to clean fft, elf, Maxima, or any other number of foam filter oils off with soap and water.

 

[Farmer]

As @CID said. I'm a 700, but the 500 uses virtually the same filter and clamping set up.

I would clean and re-oil it. Don't know how 2 different oils would react to each other...and I have doubts about the oil that is coming on the filters. See below...

If over oiling the filter caused dust collect in the intake, the one I did would have a ton of it. I'm more from the school of oil the s*** out of the thing and let it drip dry. I do this in a bag and then pour the leftover back into the bottle I'm using.

When you get the filter from Honda it's actually kind of hard to tell it has any oil on it. If you wipe it you get a little stuff on your finger or a paper towel that seems more like baby oil. I believe Honda service manuals recommend pouring x amount of oil in a bag and working it in the filter. I'd have to go look that up as for the amount, but I remember being surprised at how little it was. As I said above that's not how I go about it.

I will confess that I'm not 100% convinced that it's all the amount of oil on the filter from Honda. If you pour some of the fft above...Or any of a number of aftermarket foam filter oils, you'll see that they are super tacky and hard to clean off.
Many, many years ago I bought a bottle of Honda pro filter oil, and it was one of the best as far as that goes. It was literally like snot or that slime we used to get as a kid. It would stick to anything, so it was easy to see how it would stop dirt and dust.
Whatever comes on the new filters is definitely not that. Someone said that the oil that comes on them now is from no toil. I believe one of no toil's big selling points is that it's biodegradable and can be cleaned with water, IE GREEN.
I'm all for being environmentally friendly, but I'm more interested in stuff that actually works. And often I find those two things don't exist together. My wife asks me if I want the "green" insecticide or something. My reply is no, I'd rather have something with harsh chemicals that actually works. And I wonder if the same thing isn't going on here.
I see people talking about cleaning their filter with soapy water on here all the time. There's not the slightest chance in the deepest basement of hell that you're going to clean fft, elf, Maxima, or any other number of foam filter oils off with soap and water.

10-4 I agree with you just thought I'd throw a wrench into things. We used to use the good old Honda stuff on our CR250's for hare scrambles. Load up a one gallon bag, throw the filter in and squish it around and then squeeze of the excess. I don't care for the eco water soluble stuff at all. Always cleaned mine with gas follwed by air. Same goes for my covid mask! 😨

 

[Stateboy]

If you do decide to wash an oil soaked filter with water (and not gasoline), use a generous amount of Dawn dish soap. It'll cut through the best oil out there. After that, oil it with the recommended oil or oil of your choice. I'm not big fan of the filter element being heavily soaked with oil. Even oil will atomize when subjected to the vacuum of the intake system.

Think of it this way, if it's dripping wet, you just created a wall of liquid for necessary intake air to have to pass through. That results in intake air forcing a portion of the excess oil off the filter element and into the interior of the intake (probably with a portion collecting on the intake walls), which I suppose would then have a chance to snag any dust that would sneak past the filter or gaskets. However, it also gives you something else to have to clean out the next time you change the filter.

I just think there's a fine line of just how much oil the air filter element is meant to hold. Either way, the pressure created by the intake air will sort that out for you the first time you punch the throttle. This will cause the intake air to find or create the path(s) of least resistance.



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[CID]

Like DG, I’m a heavy oiler. We put a 4.5” dia. X 6” tall oiled foam filter on a snorkel (Talon). I was using 3.5 oz of oil but the ‘drip off’ made quite mess so I’m trying 3 oz now. I’ll still want a few drips but hoping for less mess. Plain ole 40w for this #oleguy.

After a good kerosene dipping, I’ve found Dawn cuts the remaining oil pretty well.

 

[DG Rider]

10-4 I agree with you just thought I'd throw a wrench into things. We used to use the good old Honda stuff on our CR250's for hare scrambles. Load up a one gallon bag, throw the filter in and squish it around and then squeeze of the excess. I don't care for the eco water soluble stuff at all. Always cleaned mine with gas follwed by air. Same goes for my covid mask! 😨

That's exactly what I do.



I've just never had luck with dawn. It brings some, but not all. I used to use gas simply because it worked, but never felt really comfortable since it supposedly eats the glue, so I minimized the time and got into soapy water rinse ASAP, and just tossed it after a few cleanings just in case it decided to come apart. Now I just use the parts washer at work (what we used to call varsol). It works well, but most people don't have access to that.

 

[DG Rider]

Time for a filter change again...

So in the interest of science, here is my second consecutive self-oiled filter and what the intake track looks like afterwards...

You can see a very faint finger swipe, but still better than the Honda service filter. And remember, this is two service intervals.

I'd like to see nothing here...but I don't know if ANY filter/oil combo will stop everything.

PS: I haven't included mileages simply because I don't use it to clean the filter. I clean it when it gets dirty enough to warrant it, be it 300 miles, or 3000. Looks like this one was done back in may, but that's also heading into the time of year when it's too hot to ride.

 

[LarryAmboy]

Use waterproof grease at the filter mating edges and it will stop the small amount of leakage dust you are seeing.


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