P1000 Pioneer 1000 all

[JACKAL]

@JTW

Awesome... that's good to know! Now, we're yours and the others you speak of a clutch material bonding issue? Were they all early machines?

I got mine in December 2015 it was serial#24xx off the line so one of first 2500 machines. First occurance was at initial oil change of 160 miles, not sure what happened there I have no explanation, but they were blue black from heat, however I still ran it 250 miles at 2016 Takeover knowing they were slipping. Second occurance at 1100 miles during a grueling 10 hour ride in Tackett Creek area only covered 42 miles and broke 2 axels as well that day. Still drove it out to trailer with 1 wheel drive.

Hondas may break, but have never left me stranded in 43 years of riding them.

 

[Admin]

 

[JTW]

@JTW

I got mine in December 2015 it was serial#24xx off the line so one of first 2500 machines. First occurance was at initial oil change of 160 miles, not sure what happened there I have no explanation, but they were blue black from heat, however I still ran it 250 miles at 2016 Takeover knowing they were slipping. Second occurance at 1100 miles during a grueling 10 hour ride in Tackett Creek area only covered 42 miles and broke 2 axels as well that day. Still drove it out to trailer with 1 wheel drive.

Hondas may break, but have never left me stranded in 43 years of riding them.

Got ya... and I won't disagree. The clutches could use a little improvement but they still allow that safety net if they do start premature slippage.

 

[pct]

I hope that the clutch fix is for all of the 1000s not for just the new 18 models it would suck if the new clutches would not work in the older models I personally dont think that Honda would do that but you never know.

 

[JACKAL]

I hope that the clutch fix is for all of the 1000s not for just the new 18 models it would suck if the new clutches would not work in the older models I personally dont think that Honda would do that but you never know.

Allegedly, all the parts will fit retroactively. They may or may not be offered as a kit & at a decent price. Not sure what the final decision will be but after seeing the water ingestion fix, the radiator air deflector change all being at customer expense I do not belive the revised clutch parts would be free unless a customer had them fixed under warranty.

Oddly, I have not heard of any 2017's slipping yet and there was some minor changes made in production which may save all but the most abused machines. The final solution is supposedly on the 2018 models from the get go. I plan on getting a 2018 P1K5D as soon as it is in and may even be in first half of September, I will know for sure in next 10 days as dealers get to see about 45 days out for expected shipping dates from Honda.

 

[pct]

Thanks Jackal for the info I had heard that too but that it was going to be pricey upgrade but it was not confirmed info I havent heard anything for sure mine wasnt the clutches going out it was the residue of off them but an upgrade would be great

 

[JACKAL]

Thanks Jackal for the info I had heard that too but that it was going to be pricey upgrade but it was not confirmed info I havent heard anything for sure mine wasnt the clutches going out it was the residue of off them but an upgrade would be great

That is still part of the greater issue. This is a complex deal, no one thing is the culprit, and not every situation is identical, but in the end the clutch friction plates end up with no material, mine were down to bare metal on metal.

It can start with heat, or low voltage, or pressure. The pefect storm is machine already being hot, then stuck in mud or incline, while working the winch HARD this can drop system voltage to where it affects the P1K system, under a careful eye symptoms would be momentarily seeing the power steering light come on as well as low oil pressure indicator. An additional contributing factor can be the type of oil being used other than the Honda GN4 type, certain synthetics have different viscosity levels at different temps. This too can negatively affect oil flow and pressure as to what the computer expects at temp. X and rpm X those along with oil having high moly content will glaze the friction plates, once glazed heat and time will wear them down all the same as they slip. The Honda GN4 oil has a tested moly content of approx 50 ppm, some synthetics go as high as 400 ppm and one even 800 ppm.

Additionally assembly lube can affect this as well on a brand new machine, on a motorcyle forum with fanatical details on oil testing severeral brand new hondas original oil tested 200 to 250 ppm on moly. This may be why the initial oil change is recommended at 100 miles, as well as getting all the aluminum flushed out.

If it was as simple as this one thing did it Honda could have more quickly dealt with it, but the many different ways machines were used, abused, modified, riding conditions, oils used, made for a complex diagnosis period. Also getting the detailed truth as to what was going on from the customer, to the dealer, to the Honda tech was I am sure frustrating. You tell a person a story, them have it relayed to three more people then told back to you 4th hand it can barely resemble the original details.

 

[pct]

I totally agree with you on that and I have always used honda oils and filters and sit back and read most of the posts,anything new and as complated as the 1000 is going to have problems and take time to sort out

 

[nbomar]

@JACKAL pretty sure @Jshell3 had a 2017 and his clutches went out at Takeover this year.


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[JTW]

@JACKAL pretty sure @Jshell3 had a 2017 and his clutches went out at Takeover this year.


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Yup..

 

[hondabob]

If Honda has a clutch upgrade I doubt they would ask the customer to pay for a maybe $700 dollar upgrade after paying about $20,000. They will see where most failures occur with the warranty claims. In some riding areas its slow going with mud holes and most of us like large tires for the ground clearance. After seeing the pictures on the forum I would think Honda would be doing some hard core testing. It would be great if they offered a super low geared Mud Model with 32's in the future. The slow going allows heat to build up too. If I'm going under 15 mph for more then about 15 minutes I turn on my under seat blower. The next few years will be interesting and hopefully Honda will announce some new models next month. I've been temped to install the 24 inch tires off my P500 on my P1000 wheels for some low geared testing. It would look goofy but it would be fun to play with.

 

[Luv4Chaos1]

In my opinion, the heat issue is easy to solve. With that said, why has Honda not solved it? All sxs have heat issue, however the Pioneer 1000/5 will cause a burn if you splash over a puddle. This is much different than putting up with heat. I personally haven't had a clutch failure or a water ingestion event, but I strongly feel that Honda knows, or should know they've designed a flaw. I've heard of people hear blowing their engine due to water. Honda offers a design change at the customer's cost. What about the people who had to pay for a new engine? I'm afraid to drive mine in a puddle... Should I have to add a snorkel? I'm disappointed in these issues, to say the least. I can't afford to pay 20k, then pay more to reengineer it. Please Honda, do the right thing and correct the mistakes made in either the design phase or the manufacturing.


2016 Pioneer 1000-5 Deluxe.

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[txsurfer]

I'm pretty sure you can make all the ness mods for less than a $100 (snorkel , bilge blower , seat heat shield )- hardly a hardship when spending 20K on a machine..

I don't believe I have ever once bought a toy (boats , dirtbikes , waverunners, etc ) that did not require some level of customization - and usually way more than a $100. You guy make it sound like it's the end of the world..geez. The net is a powerful tool find a solution and move on..

 

[500pilot]

Well I just received confirmation the testing went well and a lot of useful data was collected.
I think a Tow Strap may have even been used LOL

 

[Kilo427]

Yeah I got a new clutch sitting in this pile of honda parts I collect, but I am patiently (lol) waiting to see if they release a retro fix before I open her back up again, seeing as I have to take the whole rear casing off do to IGR. Is the rig perfect, nah not at all, but I love it and I love the awesome people that I have met because of it. Ill continue to attempt to fix it shortcomings and riding the piss out of it. If it breaks ill fix it, if I cant then some one on here probably can help me, if no one can fix it Ill ride with one of my many friends I have met here.

 

[GlockMeister]

Yeah I got a new clutch sitting in this pile of honda parts I collect, but I am patiently (lol) waiting to see if they release a retro fix before I open her back up again, seeing as I have to take the whole rear casing off do to IGR. Is the rig perfect, nah not at all, but I love it and I love the awesome people that I have met because of it. Ill continue to attempt to fix it shortcomings and riding the piss out of it. If it breaks ill fix it, if I cant then some one on here probably can help me, if no one can fix it Ill ride with one of my many friends I have met here.

Aaaaamen brother!

 

[500pilot]

I see some of you guys are doing clutches yourselves or at least have been in them.
Not sure if your doing this or not but it's a whole lot easier just to pull the bed than do it.

 

[Kilo427]

I see some of you guys are doing clutches yourselves or at least have been in them.
Not sure if your doing this or not but it's a whole lot easier just to pull the bed than do it.

I have done it both ways I have the cross member made with adapters that came with the IGR so I can remove it and easily access the back cover. I have done it so much though I rarely take the bed off anymore