Comparison-Pioneer 700, 2 RZR's, 60 miles

[russ344]

Hello to all,
We went on a 60 mile trail ride yesterday. There was my wife and I in our 700-4, 4 people in a Razor 800-4, and 3 people in another Razor 800-4. The ride was desert with a mix of deep sand washes, hard packed dirt, rocks, and some really steep hillclimbs.

Power-I had no problem keeping up with the Razors anywhere along the ride. However, keep in mind they had a lot more weight in them than we did.
The speeds were between 5-25 mph the entire trip and we all rode at a casual pace.

Hillclimbs-The Honda amazed everyone (especially me!) climbing hills. There were some hills that were scary long and steep. I would NEVER have
thought they were even possible to climb if I didn't see the Razors go up them first. There was one that the Razors barely made it up and the
Honda had no problem going up it. I don't know if the Razors tried it in High or low but they struggled.

Sand-The Honda was terrible in the sand. The front end pushes so much you can't even steer it. I tried it with differential lock and it didn't seem to
make any difference. I haven't checked my tire pressure yet to see what it was at. While I struggled to keep the Honda straight, the Razors had
no problem. I rode in the back so I could watch them. Their front tires were straight while I struggled with the steering wheel the entire time we
were in the sand.

Suspension-This is where I wished I had bought a Razor. The Honda rode OK, not bad. The Razors were so much better that I couldn't believe it. When
we rode over some small stutter bumps their heads were not even moving, while we were getting tossed around pretty badly. There was
no comparison in the 2. The Razors handled everything much smoother than the Honda. If anyone comes out with aftermarket suspension
for the Honda, I will be first in line to get it.

Overall, I was really pleased with the Honda. Everyone loved the look of it and couldn't believe the price they are selling for. The ride was great and we all had fun. However, if it was a fast trail ride I would never have been able to keep up. Not because of power but because of handling. I know the Polaris is a sport bike and the Honda is more of a utility/trail bike but i was still surprised at the difference in suspension. This is all just my opinion and I hope I don't get anyone angry. I am only trying to share my experience on this ride with everyone.

 

[Admin]

 

[Jaykup20]

Just goes to show that the Honda is not a one trick pony.... The rzr would not last more than a few miles on the tight trails here in Maine.... Which is why most people cruise around in rangers.....I wool be a Honda man for sure.

Thanks for sharing!

 

[b4hntn]

One thread said the 700-4 has adjustable rear suspension. Did you try different settings?

 

[Oregondunes89]

Was power lacking in the sand or was it just the steering? If the psi in your tires were full, then it would be terrible in the sand. Do you know what you were running? I want to get the P4 specifically for riding in the sand...

 

[Swamper]

Mine does well in the sand. In very slow and tight turns it does want to go straight and pushes a bit. Just a trade off to having a non-diff rear end. Traction in 4wd is as good as anything I've ridden.

 

[russ344]

I checked my tire pressures. The fronts were both 9 psi. The rears buried my 15 psi gauge so I don't know how high they were. Honda manual says 10 front 12 rear. I lowered my rears to 12 and left the fronts at 9 but I haven't tried it yet. I know these are high pressures for sand but I'm not familiar with these tires. Does anyone think I could lower the pressures without debeading them? If the pressures were lowered I think the Honda would do a LOT better.

 

[JoeyG]

Honda had my tires at 15 psi all around. I lowered my tire pressure to 3 psi both front and back tires. Made a world of difference! Smoother ride on dirt roads and much better traction on dry and wet sand. I wouldn't load up the bed with 1000 lbs without bringing pressure back up though. A lot of guys ride ranchers and foremans on the sandy creek where we ride, and we all run less than 3 lbs in all tires with no problems. But remember, that's a machine 1/2 the weight of the Pioneers.

 

[russ344]

Thanks for the info. I'm going to lower the pressures and go for a ride in the sand this weekend. I'll post the results.

 

[Bfree]

The long travel suspension of the RZR 4 is hard to beat. I had a std model '08 50" RZR before Polaris came out w/the RZR 4 and it didn't hold a candle to the ride of the RZR 4 model.

 

[Swamper]

Keep in mind that these are not apples to apples comparisons. What makes the rzr 4 ride so good is its wheelbase. Same reason the rzr 2 doesn't ride as good as the rzr 4. All suspension being equal the long wheelbase of the limo models will always ride better especially when loaded with 4 ppl. If the pioneer were that long it would ride a whole lot better too. But then again there's trade offs both ways. Turning radius and break over angles are poor with the limo. But it will always ride better than a short wheel base SxS.

 

[Jaykup20]

More or less what I was getting at with my comment..... A RZR just would not cut the sauce in Maine.

 

[russ344]

Swamper, good point about the different wheelbases. One advantage the Pioneer definitely had over the Razors was scraping going over small ledges. The drivers and passengers in the razors couldn't believe that the Pioneer didn't scrape the bottom once the whole trip while they were hitting bottom a lot.

 

[Oregondunes89]

Makes sense... I'm just curious if the pioneer would have enough power to make it around the dunes

 

[DG Rider]

Quite frankly, i don't see the 4 seat RZR's working anywhere except the wide open deserts. No way would those fit on the eastern trails i used to ride. A Pioneer would be bad enough as it is.

 

[Oregondunes89]

Anyone have any experience driving the P4 in the dunes?

 

[russ344]

OK, I just went out for a 10 mile ride in the same area as my last trip. This time I lowered front and rear tire pressures to 5 PSI. Night and day difference. More comfortable ride and worked great in the deep sandy washes. No pushing in turns or going straight when the wheels are turned. So far, no problems with the tires at the lower pressure. I would have rode longer but I'm at 99 miles and time for the first service.

 

[Oregondunes89]

Awesome! How much sand are we talkin? Can you post a pic? I'm going to be riding in ONLY sand... is it pretty deep stuff?

 

[Bfree]

Keep in mind that these are not apples to apples comparisons. What makes the rzr 4 ride so good is its wheelbase. Same reason the rzr 2 doesn't ride as good as the rzr 4. All suspension being equal the long wheelbase of the limo models will always ride better especially when loaded with 4 ppl. If the pioneer were that long it would ride a whole lot better too. But then again there's trade offs both ways. Turning radius and break over angles are poor with the limo. But it will always ride better than a short wheel base SxS.

Agree 100%

 

[Bfree]

Swamper, good point about the different wheelbases. One advantage the Pioneer definitely had over the Razors was scraping going over small ledges. The drivers and passengers in the razors couldn't believe that the Pioneer didn't scrape the bottom once the whole trip while they were hitting bottom a lot.

Agree 100% My RZR 4 drug bottom over everything until I put a lift on it. Then it started eating front diffs d/t the extreme angles put on it. I now have a 3" lift in the rear to keep it level and its stock up front w/the shocks cranked up about half way. It will still drag if 4 people are on board and an ice chest in the back but its not near as bad as stock mode.

 

[Bfree]

Quite frankly, i don't see the 4 seat RZR's working anywhere except the wide open deserts. No way would those fit on the eastern trails i used to ride. A Pioneer would be bad enough as it is.

The RZR 4 is 64 inches wide fm the factory. It does make the trails tight and d/t its length I have to make several back ups and turns to go down some trails in Arkansas mntns. Hence this is one of the reasons Im considering the P4.