P1000m5 1000-5 Tie Down Straps

[Hucker]

I would have to break out my engineering background to do a free body diagram to prove it, but it seems to me that tying the tires to the deck keeps the center of gravity at the trailer deck level, versus tying at a higher point on the UTV. I am thinking in terms of motorcycle riding - you stand up on the pegs to lower the c-o-g on rough terrain, versus keeping your butt on the seat. I can say with 100% certainty, that tying the wheels to the deck feels, on my setup, way more stable than when I used straps on other frame components and compressed the shock absorbers. With the tires secured, you can see the machine "float" on rough terrain, absorbing the bumps. When I tied to the frame, the trailer hopped on the bumps as the weigh of the machine went up and down...the shock absorbers on the UTV were unable to function as intended. To each, his own.

 

[Admin]

 

[JTW]

I would have to break out my engineering background to do a free body diagram to prove it, but it seems to me that tying the tires to the deck keeps the center of gravity at the trailer deck level, versus tying at a higher point on the UTV. I am thinking in terms of motorcycle riding - you stand up on the pegs to lower the c-o-g on rough terrain, versus keeping your butt on the seat. I can say with 100% certainty, that tying the wheels to the deck feels, on my setup, way more stable than when I used straps on other frame components and compressed the shock absorbers. With the tires secured, you can see the machine "float" on rough terrain, absorbing the bumps. When I tied to the frame, the trailer hopped on the bumps as the weigh of the machine went up and down...the shock absorbers on the UTV were unable to function as intended. To each, his own.

I see your point.. I wonder how a looped strap on both ends with shackles to the trailer and machine would serve. Not so tight that it won't allow the machine to float a little but enough to keep it in place and secured by more than just hooks so they can't come loose.

 

[allgm1]

I'm with @ohanacreek on this one. I like my pioneer and trailer to move as one, I just think for myself it feels secure while ripping down the road. @Hucker how did you attach your e trac to the trailer deck?

 

[ohanacreek]

I would have to break out my engineering background to do a free body diagram to prove it, but it seems to me that tying the tires to the deck keeps the center of gravity at the trailer deck level, versus tying at a higher point on the UTV. I am thinking in terms of motorcycle riding - you stand up on the pegs to lower the c-o-g on rough terrain, versus keeping your butt on the seat. I can say with 100% certainty, that tying the wheels to the deck feels, on my setup, way more stable than when I used straps on other frame components and compressed the shock absorbers. With the tires secured, you can see the machine "float" on rough terrain, absorbing the bumps. When I tied to the frame, the trailer hopped on the bumps as the weigh of the machine went up and down...the shock absorbers on the UTV were unable to function as intended. To each, his own.

I'd like to know, the answer to those equations. However, ou can control your body position to an extent. Pioneer is dead weight.

 

[Someguy]

I hook a rachet strap to the hole in the bottom of each arm crossed to opposite side of the trailer. I don't like compressing suspension, straps can brake if hitting a large bump causing slack buy spring compressing, then extending back out. The next time you see a semi hauling cars, look what they do. They strap tires, and axles, JMHO

 

[popeye]

See. Clearly says 3/8... but 3/8ths, what??

View attachment 39902

Stupid Amazon.

3/8" dia. Chain on a 3/8" dia pin. You could get away with 1/4" chain even at the lowest grade chain. Even though grade 30 isnt rated for transport.

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[Jshell3]

3/8" dia. Chain on a 3/8" dia pin. You could get away with 1/4" chain even at the lowest grade chain. Even though grade 30 isnt rated for transport.

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Somebody say 3/8ths!?!

 

[Hucker]

@allgm1 - I used stainless hardware every 4" along the length. It is very secure. When I ratchet the strap, you can see the tire compress until the deck starts to deflect. That is my visual cue that it is tight. I estimate I have approximately 2,000 highway miles and a couple hundred dirt-road miles of towing the Pioneer this way. I have not seen much roll of the machine when I make turns. Again, I think the machine's shock absorbers compensate during turns, versus having a strap pull up on the trailer deck. I do use one motorcycle-type ratchet strap (that loops around the tube, and hooks on itself) on one of the front a-arms to pull the machine tight into the front wheel stops I welded for the front. Just those three attachment points.

 

[scottf]

I had Fastraps on a previous trailer and towed 10's of thousands of miles with no issue so that is what I went with on my flatbed project. Really works well to have the tires secured and the suspended part suspended, especially on rough roads.

Untitled by scottf, on Flickr

Untitled by scottf, on Flickr


Untitled by scottf, on Flickr

 

[Toyhauler33]

What is the problem with compressing the suspension?

I have snapped the 1" ratchet straps by compressing the rear on my p1k5 and bent the safety chain loops on the rear hitch by using the 2" ratchet straps on bumpy roads. I vote bonnets and e-track

 

[ohanacreek]

I have snapped the 1" ratchet straps by compressing the rear on my p1k5 and bent the safety chain loops on the rear hitch by using the 2" ratchet straps on bumpy roads. I vote bonnets and e-track

I have 2" 4000lb load with 11,000 break straps and I tie around the ROPS like in the manual. Most of the 1" straps are 500lb load 1200lb break straps and no where near enough for a 2000lb vehicle.

What I should have asked is...

Is there any possible way of damaging the suspension by compressing it? Is that everyone's fear or is it like you said the suspension compresses and comes loose. The straps on those bonnets are way stronger than a 1" strap.

Most Etrack I've seen doesn't have the load capacity of a decent d-ring.

Obviously not all the way to the bump stops but compressed enough it would take a severe bump to loosen the straps.

 

[RyanOrange3]

You won't damage the suspension. On mine I suck down the front with one strap and roll the pioneer back to soak up any play and two straps backwards, compressing the rear suspension. This keeps tension on the straps at all times. I got about 3-5 inches.
I've traveled 6 hours to and from in a icey snow storm like that.

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[JCutah]

I figure my first post should look intelligent. I have used these on my atv, now pioneer (flash) and my brother in law works for coke and they use these to hold the vending machines down while traveling.

This exact strap works for the method Honda expects us to tie it down. Never had issues with the strap coming undone. And I have yet to break one. Been on nasty Utah and Montana roads and tested these.

7′ Ratchet Strap (Quantity 1)

 

[Muleyhunter]

I've compressed the suspension on my bikes for years while trailering and have yet to have an issue with seals or anything. I wouldn't recommend compressing it to the stop or leaving it compressed for long periods of time (days, as opposed to hours), but I doubt it's an issue. As you say, Honda recommends it. One thing to keep in mind though is that by compressing the suspension when you tie down, you're also relying on the suspension to keep the straps taught. Unless you've got something to capture the hooks so they don't fall off, you could come unhooked as the suspension compresses further. I've had bikes lose a strap before and suspected this was the cause. I don't do that anymore if I can avoid it.

I bought my P1000-5 last summer and immediately took it on a 1000 mile trip. I tied it down per Honda advice to the ROPS and had this exact issue of tie downs coming unhooked. Had to make lots of stops to check everything. Even when there wasn't a problem, I imagined there was and had to check everything out. Then this past January, I saw a demo of these straps at the the Dallas Safari Club Convention. I picked up four. I've only used them for some relatively short tows but they seem to work as advertised. The urethane link acts as a shock absorber if the suspension "rocks". So far, I'm a real believer in them. Pricey but gives me a real peace of mind.
Ratchet Straps | Tie Downs Straps

 

[ToddACimer]

I bought my P1000-5 last summer and immediately took it on a 1000 mile trip. I tied it down per Honda advice to the ROPS and had this exact issue of tie downs coming unhooked. Had to make lots of stops to check everything. Even when there wasn't a problem, I imagined there was and had to check everything out. Then this past January, I saw a demo of these straps at the the Dallas Safari Club Convention. I picked up four. I've only used them for some relatively short tows but they seem to work as advertised. The urethane link acts as a shock absorber if the suspension "rocks". So far, I'm a real believer in them. Pricey but gives me a real peace of mind.
Ratchet Straps | Tie Downs Straps

I use shock straps on mine too. They work great

 

[O2bsmitty]

When using these shock straps how do you know if it is tight enough or too tight to keep them working? Watching that video it appears if you tighten it tight you would pull the "give" out of the spring action?

 

[ToddACimer]

When using these shock straps how do you know if it is tight enough or too tight to keep them working? Watching that video it appears if you tighten it tight you would pull the "give" out of the spring action?

The poly block in the middle of the strap stretches 1-1.5" and the machine will feel stable. The instructions make it clear how to do it but just using them a few times you get a feel for it. I use regular ratchet straps on the front and these on the back

 

[Muleyhunter]

When using these shock straps how do you know if it is tight enough or too tight to keep them working? Watching that video it appears if you tighten it tight you would pull the "give" out of the spring action?

Ditto what @ToddACimer said. Plus on the urethane link is a visual "spring" molded into the urethane. It gives you a nice visual of how tight it is. At the demo that I saw, the owner of the company told me a good rule of thumb is when you can easily slip your hand between the urethane link and the safety strap, just slightly rubbing. But like Todd said, you quickly get a feel for it. The safety strap is in case the urethane link was to ever snap. The owner told me that he's only had one returned that was snapped. It had been stored outside in the sun, possibly a pickup bed and must have deteriorated.

 

[ohiohunter]

Here is how I do mine...

E-track on trailer, tie at least 2 tires to the trailer, and let the suspension work the way it is intended. Rock solid on Highway and off road. Easy on and off.

The e-track can be purchased at most hardware type stores (Tractor Supply, Cal Ranch, etc). It is relatively inexpensive, but strong. It lays flat on the trailer deck without being in the way when the trailer is needed for plywood/drywall/et al.

View attachment 39847 View attachment 39850

I use this as well. I've traveled hundreds of miles this way and haven't moved an inch. Best I've ever found.

 

[ripHST]

I bought my P1000-5 last summer and immediately took it on a 1000 mile trip. I tied it down per Honda advice to the ROPS and had this exact issue of tie downs coming unhooked. Had to make lots of stops to check everything. Even when there wasn't a problem, I imagined there was and had to check everything out. Then this past January, I saw a demo of these straps at the the Dallas Safari Club Convention. I picked up four. I've only used them for some relatively short tows but they seem to work as advertised. The urethane link acts as a shock absorber if the suspension "rocks". So far, I'm a real believer in them. Pricey but gives me a real peace of mind.
Ratchet Straps | Tie Downs Straps

These look interesting. I may have to give them a try sometime.

I posted earlier in this thread that I use the Erikson wheel bonnets. I still do and still love them. I've modified my method a bit in that I also throw a strap through the clevis I keep in my hitch or through the roll bar to stabilize the sprung mass. I've never felt anything from the truck while I was towing, but seeing it sway was distracting.

The only downside to the Erikson set up is having the cleat sitting so proud of the trailer deck. In the beginning, while still getting used to the engagement of the clutch, it could actually be a little challenging getting over it without wondering if you're going to launch into the back of the truck. But I'm used to it now and I like that it's quite a bit more substantial than the track system.