Really need EVERY Talon owner to participate in this Power Steering Poll

[Blownzuki]

I haven’t had a issue. I have heavy 35’s.

 

[amelung45x]

I want to vote on this but I dont think my vote would really count since I haven't ridden on any trails in over a year. The times I do drive mine is from backyard garage to front garage just to warm the fluids up and keep the gas from going bad. Im all for any improvements on anything for the talon. Since I'm rebuilding mine I really only want to do it once and not to have to do it again. I have seen Raceco USA cooling system for the power steering set up. I scratch my head thinking is it worth doing or just more money to spend on something that isn't needed. Granted my steering box is stock since nothing aftermarket was out yet when mine broke in half. If its worth buying a better steering set up then I'm all for it. Ill keep watching this post to get smarter on the issue and to get feed back on what everyone else issues are with their steering.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

Has anyone tried using a bilge fan on it? A bunch of us used them on the pioneer under the seat to blow engine heat out.

 

[906UP]

I checked other, I really haven't had a problem but I wouldn't call it perfect either. Seems a bit weak at times but can't really give an example. Compared to my P5 w an aftermarket unit the Talon is weak

 

[CID]

I checked other, I really haven't had a problem but I wouldn't call it perfect either. Seems a bit weak at times but can't really give an example. Compared to my P5 w an aftermarket unit the Talon is weak

Well, that just sucks.

 

[PaulF]

I want to vote on this but I dont think my vote would really count since I haven't ridden on any trails in over a year. The times I do drive mine is from backyard garage to front garage just to warm the fluids up and keep the gas from going bad. Im all for any improvements on anything for the talon. Since I'm rebuilding mine I really only want to do it once and not to have to do it again. I have seen Raceco USA cooling system for the power steering set up. I scratch my head thinking is it worth doing or just more money to spend on something that isn't needed. Granted my steering box is stock since nothing aftermarket was out yet when mine broke in half. If its worth buying a better steering set up then I'm all for it. Ill keep watching this post to get smarter on the issue and to get feed back on what everyone else issues are with their steering.

Has anyone tried using a bilge fan on it? A bunch of us used them on the pioneer under the seat to blow engine heat out.

Heat is not an issue for the average rider. Before relocating the ECU, my PS sucked stone cold and made no difference as the day went on, even in 100 degree heat.

Now, if you are a racer or run super hard for extended periods AND find your PS actually fading/diminishing as it heats up, by all means, cool that sucker down. If it sucks when cold, adding a fan will not fix anything.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

Heat is not an issue for the average rider. Before relocating the ECU, my PS sucked stone cold and made no difference as the day went on, even in 100 degree heat.

Now, if you are a racer or run super hard for extended periods AND find your PS actually fading/diminishing as it heats up, by all means, cool that sucker down. If it sucks when cold, adding a fan will not fix anything.

10-4. I thought u were moving it for heat issues.

 

[CID]

10-4. I thought u were moving it for heat issues.

Background - Paul's theory is that the wire gauge is too small for the load of the motor and distance between the EPS ECU and the PS motor. He's moved the ECU up by the PS motor and increased the wire gauge. Initial results have been very promising.

 

[BrianM]

It's only happened to me once. One of the front tires must have been pushed sideways by a rock. The wheel twisted fast and hard. It hurt my thumb. I now hold the wheel with my thumb on the outside of the wheel on rocky roads. I was probably going about 5mph at the time.

 

[BrianM]

Background - Paul's theory is that the wire gauge is too small for the load of the motor and distance between the EPS ECU and the PS motor. He's moved the ECU up by the PS motor and increased the wire gauge. Initial results have been very promising.

I wonder if that is the issue, why not just increase the wire gauge size even more to avoid having to move the ECU? Is there that much power drain even with a larger gauge wire?

 

[CID]

I wonder if that is the issue, why not just increase the wire gauge size even more to avoid having to move the ECU? Is there that much power drain even with a larger gauge wire?

Paul gives his reasoning and a LOT of useful information here -

Honda talon stiff power steering

I am having issues with my power steering on my talon x4. It gets stiff from time to time. I have checked the battery by load test, connections, grounds and loose wires. Has anyone else had this issue?

hondasxs.com

 

[PaulF]

UPDATE:

Lots of testing happening. 10 day trip in Nevada, Arizona and Sand Hollow. Some very good and some not so good. Trail riding was great, Rock crawling at Sand Hollow was a disaster.

Steering assist is greatly improved but overheating is now a real problem, especially when doing technical maneuvers. The motor and ECU are too close to each other and they both generate heat causing limp mode (ECU reduces/completely kills assist to let it cool down) more easily.

Steering came and went on Wayne's World but then overheated badly and completely lost assist on Double Sammy at the worse possible place. Took me forever to finish the last part. Cooled down at the top while we watched a bunch of Jeeps struggling on the Chute and the assist returned just fine.

Mine is going worse than most, I have a completely closed firewall from hood down to the skids so there is little air flow. I removed my cowl and it improved it somewhat but still overheated on West Rim the next day.

So, back to the drawing board. I have notified my other testers about the issue and am currently working on Prototype #2. Should have new test kits out by the end of the week for more testing and I am headed right back out to Moab for 10 days starting this Saturday so I will be able to thoroughly test the new prototype in the conditions that are giving me the worst problems.

Stay tuned!

 

[Fyathyrio]

IIRC, you previously mentioned that the computer allowed higher current to the PS system when in i4WD, and there was a way to bypass it for high current in 2WD. Did you have this bypass on during this ride, or were you always in i4WD?

 

[PaulF]

IIRC, you previously mentioned that the computer allowed higher current to the PS system when in i4WD, and there was a way to bypass it for high current in 2WD. Did you have this bypass on during this ride, or were you always in i4WD?

My test rig has a switchable bypass so I can set it low power (even in 4wd), normal or full power all the time. Because the TorqLocker does cause some steering stiffness, I have tried with mine bypassed to full power all day at the dunes and trail riding without any issues. It is the slow speed stuff that is problematic.

Problems started during crawling in 4WD Low at slow speeds during technical sections. The more turning, the quicker it overheated. Even happened on West Rim and that is very tame (rated 4) but there are couple switchbacks that caused a shutdown. I had the cowl off at this point so as soon as I started moving again, assist returned pretty quickly.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

Anyway to put a/several heatsinks on the parts?

 

[PaulF]

Anyway to put a/several heatsinks on the parts?

Working on that angle as we speak.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

I saw where the pioneer is getting the whole power steering system upgraded on the '22. Wonder if the Talon will follow suit. I haven't looked but imagine its close or the same parts between the 2.

 

[PaulF]

I saw where the pioneer is getting the whole power steering system upgraded on the '22. Wonder if the Talon will follow suit. I haven't looked but imagine its close or the same parts between the 2.

I saw that too. It appears the motor and ECU are combined into one unit. There are some differences in the u-joints and shafts too. As soon as my dealer has one on the floor, I will investigate and see how much better the pioneer is, what the differences are and if it is feasible to retrofit.

What baffles me is the pioneer is not known for steering issues and the Talon is yet they upgrade the Pioneer??? Honda needs to do more consumer research IMO.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

I saw that too. It appears the motor and ECU are combined into one unit. There are some differences in the u-joints and shafts too. As soon as my dealer has one on the floor, I will investigate and see how much better the pioneer is, what the differences are and if it is feasible to retrofit.

What baffles me is the pioneer is not known for steering issues and the Talon is yet they upgrade the Pioneer??? Honda needs to do more consumer research IMO.

My Pioneer steering sucked in the rocks when it got hot. I pulled both arm muscles every ride. Pretty much had to roll to get it to turn. 32" stickys though.