P1000 2023 Forest or Trail? Could use some buying advice

[Drew S]

Hi all,

New to the group though have been reading posts for a while now, as I've been contemplating which model of SxS to get for the past 8 or so months. I've settled on a P1K- 5, either Forest or Trail, but would love to hear opinions from people with real-world experience with the machines in use.

I live in Colorado, and we moved to large forested property at 8000' near Evergreen a couple of years ago that has been neglected by previous owners, with a lot of trees that need felled, bucked and split, as well as clearing slash. I need a machine for this, and for dirt work (putting roads in on the property as well as creating level terraces around the house for more of a "yard", we really are on the side of a mountain near the top,) and am planning to use this as "mini-dump truck" for the dirt work, loading it with my Kubota track loader. I can't use the track loader for everything because while I have some flat spots, half of our property is at the bottom of a steep gully from our house with a lot of rock features (I actually have my own bouldering walls in that area, they are large enough to climb, and want to put in my own mountain bike trail), after which it becomes much more level property with both woods and meadows, lots of trees and slash to clear, but no road down there. Due to the angle and rocky terrain I can't get the track loader down there at present, so will be slowly building a road from the top, where we do have paved road access.

I also have friends who are Jeep owners that go offroad frequently on 4x4 trails, and we have a LOT of dirt trails around here to ride on. I also go to Moab regularly for recreation and would love to have something I can tow behind my camper van for fun trail-riding weekends. So while I'm going to be using it for work quite a bit, I'm also going to be using it for trail fun much of the time; at first probably 50/50, but as I get the work done it will be more for play.

I've been comparing these models and love the idea of the Trail with the Fox shocks for good recreation times, but wonder how well that will work for dirt, tree and log hauling. Anyone with experience using either of these for both functions? I'm leaning toward the trail for the fun aspect, but worry the suspension will be less pleasant for the work portion. Any thoughts or opinions? Thanks in advance for any suggestions you can provide!

 

[Smitty335]

Hi all,

New to the group though have been reading posts for a while now, as I've been contemplating which model of SxS to get for the past 8 or so months. I've settled on a P1K- 5, either Forest or Trail, but would love to hear opinions from people with real-world experience with the machines in use.

I live in Colorado, and we moved to large forested property at 8000' near Evergreen a couple of years ago that has been neglected by previous owners, with a lot of trees that need felled, bucked and split, as well as clearing slash. I need a machine for this, and for dirt work (putting roads in on the property as well as creating level terraces around the house for more of a "yard", we really are on the side of a mountain near the top,) and am planning to use this as "mini-dump truck" for the dirt work, loading it with my Kubota track loader. I can't use the track loader for everything because while I have some flat spots, half of our property is at the bottom of a steep gully from our house with a lot of rock features (I actually have my own bouldering walls in that area, they are large enough to climb, and want to put in my own mountain bike trail), after which it becomes much more level property with both woods and meadows, lots of trees and slash to clear, but no road down there. Due to the angle and rocky terrain I can't get the track loader down there at present, so will be slowly building a road from the top, where we do have paved road access.

I also have friends who are Jeep owners that go offroad frequently on 4x4 trails, and we have a LOT of dirt trails around here to ride on. I also go to Moab regularly for recreation and would love to have something I can tow behind my camper van for fun trail-riding weekends. So while I'm going to be using it for work quite a bit, I'm also going to be using it for trail fun much of the time; at first probably 50/50, but as I get the work done it will be more for play.

I've been comparing these models and love the idea of the Trail with the Fox shocks for good recreation times, but wonder how well that will work for dirt, tree and log hauling. Anyone with experience using either of these for both functions? I'm leaning toward the trail for the fun aspect, but worry the suspension will be less pleasant for the work portion. Any thoughts or opinions? Thanks in advance for any suggestions you can provide!

Can't go wrong with Honda for work. I don't care for the I4WD on either, if the Deluxe came with good shocks, it would be a no brainer. But that's just me.

 

[JenElio]

Hi all,

New to the group though have been reading posts for a while now, as I've been contemplating which model of SxS to get for the past 8 or so months. I've settled on a P1K- 5, either Forest or Trail, but would love to hear opinions from people with real-world experience with the machines in use.

I live in Colorado, and we moved to large forested property at 8000' near Evergreen a couple of years ago that has been neglected by previous owners, with a lot of trees that need felled, bucked and split, as well as clearing slash. I need a machine for this, and for dirt work (putting roads in on the property as well as creating level terraces around the house for more of a "yard", we really are on the side of a mountain near the top,) and am planning to use this as "mini-dump truck" for the dirt work, loading it with my Kubota track loader. I can't use the track loader for everything because while I have some flat spots, half of our property is at the bottom of a steep gully from our house with a lot of rock features (I actually have my own bouldering walls in that area, they are large enough to climb, and want to put in my own mountain bike trail), after which it becomes much more level property with both woods and meadows, lots of trees and slash to clear, but no road down there. Due to the angle and rocky terrain I can't get the track loader down there at present, so will be slowly building a road from the top, where we do have paved road access.

I also have friends who are Jeep owners that go offroad frequently on 4x4 trails, and we have a LOT of dirt trails around here to ride on. I also go to Moab regularly for recreation and would love to have something I can tow behind my camper van for fun trail-riding weekends. So while I'm going to be using it for work quite a bit, I'm also going to be using it for trail fun much of the time; at first probably 50/50, but as I get the work done it will be more for play.

I've been comparing these models and love the idea of the Trail with the Fox shocks for good recreation times, but wonder how well that will work for dirt, tree and log hauling. Anyone with experience using either of these for both functions? I'm leaning toward the trail for the fun aspect, but worry the suspension will be less pleasant for the work portion. Any thoughts or opinions? Thanks in advance for any suggestions you can provide!

Welcome from South Florida

Don't have much experience with those new models but.....if you're considering using the "dump bed" a lot, especially loading it with your Kubota, I'd consider the 3 seater....or at least consider removing the rear cage on the 5 seater and installing a bed mat. And remember, aside from the I4WD you can always upgrade pretty much everything else at a later date once it becomes a full time fun toy vs a work toy.

Good luck 👍

 

[Scoop]

I picked up my machine in 2021 and specifically went for the Deluxe to avoid i4WD. (Some like it, some don't). Personally, I like to decide and know what my differentials are doing, not let some computer or sensors decide when to go in and out of lock. I then (among other things) purchased and installed the Fox QS3 adjustable shocks (what the new Trail comes with but the Forest does not). World of difference between those and the stock shocks.

If you are OK with i4WD and want a Forest or Trail, I'd go with the Trail. If you don't, as soon as you start spending more time on the trails and less working, you'll wish you had the Fox QS3 shocks. You can add them later, but not sure what it will cost by the time you do that. I paid ~$1,400 and installed them myself, but I believe they went up to around $1,500 recently.

Either way, you can't go wrong in the end - it's a Honda Pioneer! Good luck.

 

[Drew S]

Can't go wrong with Honda for work. I don't care for the I4WD on either, if the Deluxe came with good shocks, it would be a no brainer. But that's just me.

I can understand that, I prefer locking diffs myself, though I've changed my thinking some since getting my 4x4 Sprinter van--I've been really impressed with some of the stuff I've been able to take it up when camping in the backcountry. I once went up some sizeable rock steps that people in SUV's were having difficulty getting up, and while I was camping there some people in lifted 4x4 trucks were amazed I could get it up that trail and stopped to gawk/chat. After reading a lot of reviews of the i4WD and watching some technical trail videos, I'm comfortable giving it a shot.

Overall, I like the shock setups on the Trail/Forest better, I'm just trying to figure out if I'd be unhappy with the property work if I didn't get the self-leveling shocks of the Forest MORE than I'd be unhappy for not having the Fox shocks on the Trail during recreating times.

Welcome from South Florida

Don't have much experience with those new models but.....if you're considering using the "dump bed" a lot, especially loading it with your Kubota, I'd consider the 3 seater....or at least consider removing the rear cage on the 5 seater and installing a bed mat. And remember, aside from the I4WD you can always upgrade pretty much everything else at a later date once it becomes a full time fun toy vs a work toy.

Good luck 👍

I'm definitely planning on doing a bed liner for the dirt work, or at least a beefy tarp to keep the dirt contained. I did think of getting the 3-seater but I can't find any for sale around here, everyone has the 5's, plus when we go trail riding I'd be carrying passengers and kids at least some of the time, so the 5-seater is a draw for that. Plus like you said I can always remove the rear cage for times where it's primarily a workhorse.

I picked up my machine in 2021 and specifically went for the Deluxe to avoid i4WD. (Some like it, some don't). Personally, I like to decide and know what my differentials are doing, not let some computer or sensors decide when to go in and out of lock. I then (among other things) purchased and installed the Fox QS3 adjustable shocks (what the new Trail comes with but the Forest does not). World of difference between those and the stock shocks.

If you are OK with i4WD and want a Forest or Trail, I'd go with the Trail. If you don't, as soon as you start spending more time on the trails and less working, you'll wish you had the Fox QS3 shocks. You can add them later, but not sure what it will cost by the time you do that. I paid ~$1,400 and installed them myself, but I believe they went up to around $1,500 recently.

Either way, you can't go wrong in the end - it's a Honda Pioneer! Good luck.

Thanks for that advice! I'd still consider the Deluxe and adding the Fox shocks, I've changed my own motorcycle shocks plenty so that's not a big deal to do the labor. I've only test-driven a Deluxe and liked it; I'm going to go test drive a Forest and Trail in the next week or so to get a feel for the i4WD. I was wondering more if I'd hate not having self-leveling shocks for all the heavy property work. (Go Redwings!)

 

[Smitty335]

I can understand that, I prefer locking diffs myself, though I've changed my thinking some since getting my 4x4 Sprinter van--I've been really impressed with some of the stuff I've been able to take it up when camping in the backcountry. I once went up some sizeable rock steps that people in SUV's were having difficulty getting up, and while I was camping there some people in lifted 4x4 trucks were amazed I could get it up that trail and stopped to gawk/chat. After reading a lot of reviews of the i4WD and watching some technical trail videos, I'm comfortable giving it a shot.

Overall, I like the shock setups on the Trail/Forest better, I'm just trying to figure out if I'd be unhappy with the property work if I didn't get the self-leveling shocks of the Forest MORE than I'd be unhappy for not having the Fox shocks on the Trail during recreating times.




I'm definitely planning on doing a bed liner for the dirt work, or at least a beefy tarp to keep the dirt contained. I did think of getting the 3-seater but I can't find any for sale around here, everyone has the 5's, plus when we go trail riding I'd be carrying passengers and kids at least some of the time, so the 5-seater is a draw for that. Plus like you said I can always remove the rear cage for times where it's primarily a workhorse.



Thanks for that advice! I'd still consider the Deluxe and adding the Fox shocks, I've changed my own motorcycle shocks plenty so that's not a big deal to do the labor. I've only test-driven a Deluxe and liked it; I'm going to go test drive a Forest and Trail in the next week or so to get a feel for the i4WD. I was wondering more if I'd hate not having self-leveling shocks for all the heavy property work. (Go Redwings!)

The self leveling shocks are terrible on trails. The self levelers only work when moving, they will squat while loading. I removed mine and use it as always with different shocks and never looked back. The Pioneer is a great machine, enjoy it!

 

[Drew S]

The self leveling shocks are terrible on trails. The self levelers only work when moving, they will squat while loading. I removed mine and use it as always with different shocks and never looked back. The Pioneer is a great machine, enjoy it!

Thanks a ton Smitty, sounds like I'd be best wtih a Deluxe if I want a true locking diff and upgrade the shocks myself, vs a Trail.

 

[Smitty335]

Thanks a ton Smitty, sounds like I'd be best wtih a Deluxe if I want a true locking diff and upgrade the shocks myself, vs a Trail.

Pick your Poison! HA! During normal trail riding I run in 4WD and when I run into one of those ow poop moments, lock, piece of mind, I've got control of the 4WD. Have fun which ever way you go!

 

[P1K5Dave]

You won't have any worries about doing work with the Fox shocks. If you want to, you could put heavier springs on the rear until your work load lightens.

 

[Scoop]

^^ What @P1K5Dave said.

I can understand that, I prefer locking diffs myself, though I've changed my thinking some since getting my 4x4 Sprinter van--I've been really impressed with some of the stuff I've been able to take it up when camping in the backcountry. I once went up some sizeable rock steps that people in SUV's were having difficulty getting up, and while I was camping there some people in lifted 4x4 trucks were amazed I could get it up that trail and stopped to gawk/chat. After reading a lot of reviews of the i4WD and watching some technical trail videos, I'm comfortable giving it a shot.

Overall, I like the shock setups on the Trail/Forest better, I'm just trying to figure out if I'd be unhappy with the property work if I didn't get the self-leveling shocks of the Forest MORE than I'd be unhappy for not having the Fox shocks on the Trail during recreating times.

Thanks for that advice! I'd still consider the Deluxe and adding the Fox shocks, I've changed my own motorcycle shocks plenty so that's not a big deal to do the labor. I've only test-driven a Deluxe and liked it; I'm going to go test drive a Forest and Trail in the next week or so to get a feel for the i4WD. I was wondering more if I'd hate not having self-leveling shocks for all the heavy property work. (Go Redwings!)

I have zero issues with using my Deluxe with the Fox QS3 shocks all around our property for all kinds of hauling and such, but I could most certaintly feel the bone-jarring effects of the stock cushions when riding around here on roughly terrain.

I actually purchased the Fox QS3 shocks for my Deluxed and, before I installed them, I swapped the OEM progressive rate springs for linear springs (Viper) and, while doing so, was actually able to select the spring rates (front and back) based on what I planned on carrying and riding.

It's all about what you want to do and who you want to do it.

 

[toddvdh]

I would get the lower model and upgrade the shocks later personally.

My I-4wd works good on my Talon for trail riding and mud, but I despise how it acts in deep snow.

 

[StewB]

2021 P1K5 LE (Fox QS3 shocks), here.

I 've never had a problem with i4wd. I have ridden with both Deluxe lockers and Limited Edition i4wd and think people strongly like one or the other and there isn't as much difference as people suggest. (This is coming from a guy who's had 2 4Runner Trail/Off Road's and who's never used the A-TRAC dials above the mirror. I like my low range and lockers and don't need more.)

As for load issues, I haul a lot of wood and stuff in the bed and haven't noticed a sag. I do not, however, load it up with a track hoe - my experience may not be yours.

Best.
(I hear the thundering keystrokes of an approaching storm - the locker crowd is coming for me.)

 

[Drew S]

You won't have any worries about doing work with the Fox shocks. If you want to, you could put heavier springs on the rear until your work load lightens.

That's a really good idea, especially if I'm installing them myself.

^^ What @P1K5Dave said.


I have zero issues with using my Deluxe with the Fox QS3 shocks all around our property for all kinds of hauling and such, but I could most certaintly feel the bone-jarring effects of the stock cushions when riding around here on roughly terrain.

I actually purchased the Fox QS3 shocks for my Deluxed and, before I installed them, I swapped the OEM progressive rate springs for linear springs (Viper) and, while doing so, was actually able to select the spring rates (front and back) based on what I planned on carrying and riding.

It's all about what you want to do and who you want to do it.

I did the same thing on my sport-touring motorcycle to give me the feel I wanted both with and without cargo. And if I'm doing the shocks myself I can easily swap the springs.

I would get the lower model and upgrade the shocks later personally.

My I-4wd works good on my Talon for trail riding and mud, but I despise how it acts in deep snow.

Oh this would be info to hear--what happens in deep snow? Not entirely sure I'd be using mine in deep snow, the upper half of our property is steep enough that going off tar would be treacherous in any vehicle, I think; it drops 1000' to the lower half over around 100-150 yards. But I'm still curious, and have you driven a Deluxe with locking diff in the same kind of snow?

2021 P1K5 LE (Fox QS3 shocks), here.

I 've never had a problem with i4wd. I have ridden with both Deluxe lockers and Limited Edition i4wd and think people strongly like one or the other and there isn't as much difference as people suggest. (This is coming from a guy who's had 2 4Runner Trail/Off Road's and who's never used the A-TRAC dials above the mirror. I like my low range and lockers and don't need more.)

As for load issues, I haul a lot of wood and stuff in the bed and haven't noticed a sag. I do not, however, load it up with a track hoe - my experience may not be yours.

Best.
(I hear the thundering keystrokes of an approaching storm - the locker crowd is coming for me.)

LOL. When you pop into low on the i4WD model, is that true locking, or more like the "hill assist" feature of AWD vehicles with limited slip differentials? (My understanding of the i4WD is that it's more like a limited slip, and/or uses wheel braking on spinning wheels, to achieve 4WD, like my Sprinter van with factory 4x4.) Have you run the i4WD in deep snow or mud?

 

[Smitty335]

That's a really good idea, especially if I'm installing them myself.


I did the same thing on my sport-touring motorcycle to give me the feel I wanted both with and without cargo. And if I'm doing the shocks myself I can easily swap the springs.


Oh this would be info to hear--what happens in deep snow? Not entirely sure I'd be using mine in deep snow, the upper half of our property is steep enough that going off tar would be treacherous in any vehicle, I think; it drops 1000' to the lower half over around 100-150 yards. But I'm still curious, and have you driven a Deluxe with locking diff in the same kind of snow?

LOL. When you pop into low on the i4WD model, is that true locking, or more like the "hill assist" feature of AWD vehicles with limited slip differentials? (My understanding of the i4WD is that it's more like a limited slip, and/or uses wheel braking on spinning wheels, to achieve 4WD, like my Sprinter van with factory 4x4.) Have you run the i4WD in deep snow or mud?

YEP!

 

[Smitty335]

That's a really good idea, especially if I'm installing them myself.


I did the same thing on my sport-touring motorcycle to give me the feel I wanted both with and without cargo. And if I'm doing the shocks myself I can easily swap the springs.


Oh this would be info to hear--what happens in deep snow? Not entirely sure I'd be using mine in deep snow, the upper half of our property is steep enough that going off tar would be treacherous in any vehicle, I think; it drops 1000' to the lower half over around 100-150 yards. But I'm still curious, and have you driven a Deluxe with locking diff in the same kind of snow?

LOL. When you pop into low on the i4WD model, is that true locking, or more like the "hill assist" feature of AWD vehicles with limited slip differentials? (My understanding of the i4WD is that it's more like a limited slip, and/or uses wheel braking on spinning wheels, to achieve 4WD, like my Sprinter van with factory 4x4.) Have you run the i4WD in deep snow or mud?

YEP!

 

[Scoop]

I did the same thing on my sport-touring motorcycle to give me the feel I wanted both with and without cargo. And if I'm doing the shocks myself I can easily swap the springs.

Same here. What kind of S/T bikes did you ride? I spent many, many years and many, many miles on numerous Honda VFRs (fourth and fifth generations) as well as a 2010 Kawasaki C14 (Concours).

 

[Drew S]

Same here. What kind of S/T bikes did you ride? I spent many, many years and many, many miles on numerous Honda VFRs (fourth and fifth generations) as well as a 2010 Kawasaki C14 (Concours).

I had an old Kawasaki GK1100, then a Triumph Thunderbird (not sport touring but I toured on it hard and would race it down the Dragon and the Cherohala Skyway with the Daytona guys I rode with lol) and since 2006 it's been my FJR1300, farkled to the extreme lol. Got a few self-recorded Iron Butts under my belt on that one.

 

[dweber23tr]

Keep in mind if using this for work moving gravel and such, the bed won't dump with anything like that in it. Your going to be shoveling it out. The "lift assist" dump bed is a bad joke if you have more than a shovel in there, but so is every other type out there across all brands that is not using electric or hydraulic cylinders. I have a 23 1000-5 trail. I wanted the forest because of the load leveler shocks but couldn't find a forest when I bought so went with what my dealer had and the fox shocks are amazing. Glad I got it over the forest.

 

[Drew S]

Ye

Keep in mind if using this for work moving gravel and such, the bed won't dump with anything like that in it. Your going to be shoveling it out. The "lift assist" dump bed is a bad joke if you have more than a shovel in there, but so is every other type out there across all brands that is not using electric or hydraulic cylinders. I have a 23 1000-5 trail. I wanted the forest because of the load leveler shocks but couldn't find a forest when I bought so went with what my dealer had and the fox shocks are amazing. Glad I got it over the forest.

Yeah I didn't expect to be able to load 800 lbs of dirt and have it easily "dump", but it's a lot better than using the loader to carry dirt everywhere, since the loader is soooooo slow. Plus tracks aren't cheap.

Glad to hear you're not disappointed you got the Trail over the Forest, though!

 

[HondaTech]

The only thing not easily added (atleast for the moment) off the trail model is the factory interior light in the floorboard.

But I also haven't seen many deluxe models yet, but we've had like 10 or 15 Trail models come and go