P1000 P1000 broken engine mounting bolts

bumperm

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Before I get all worried about leaving my motor behind on the trail . . . how prevalent is this? Is the style of driving/terrain a factor? Is it poor design or the luck of the draw? Maybe sloppy assembly is at play? I know, on my '21 machine, there were way over tightened fasteners, some too loose, and a few they didn't bother to install. There were broken tool parts left in the machine, including a bit of plastic from a probably dropped and cracked lithium battery and a short length of a rattail file that had obviously been misused as an alignment tool and had snapped off.
 
P

packer58

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Before I get all worried about leaving my motor behind on the trail . . . how prevalent is this? Is the style of driving/terrain a factor? Is it poor design or the luck of the draw? Maybe sloppy assembly is at play? I know, on my '21 machine, there were way over tightened fasteners, some too loose, and a few they didn't bother to install. There were broken tool parts left in the machine, including a bit of plastic from a probably dropped and cracked lithium battery and a short length of a rattail file that had obviously been misused as an alignment tool and had snapped off.
Following this as well ........
 
D

dweber23tr

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Maybe tey taking it to an exhaust shop? Those guys deal with recessed broken bolts all the time when working with rusted exhaust bolts. When I had headers put in my truck the guy at the shop I took it too had to weld onto half of them to get them out because they were already broken off or broke trying to get them out.
 
bumperm

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I would recommend everyone swap those bolts out with 12.9s. McMastercarr has what u need.

What ones are you looking at? Part number? The only ones I find at McC in 12.9 strength are these M10 - 1.25 cap head.

McMaster-Carr thats for the 25mm length.

Is 25 mm the correct length given the stock bolts are flanged, and with the cap head would need washers. If I got 30mm length I could make thicker washers on the lathe.
 
snuffnwhisky

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What ones are you looking at? Part number? The only ones I find at McC in 12.9 strength are these M10 - 1.25 cap head.

McMaster-Carr thats for the 25mm length.

Is 25 mm the correct length given the stock bolts are flanged, and with the cap head would need washers. If I got 30mm length I could make thicker washers on the lathe.
Yea Cap Heads are typically only 12.9. 10.9 hex would still be better than stock.
 
joeymt33

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Before I get all worried about leaving my motor behind on the trail . . . how prevalent is this? Is the style of driving/terrain a factor? Is it poor design or the luck of the draw? Maybe sloppy assembly is at play? I know, on my '21 machine, there were way over tightened fasteners, some too loose, and a few they didn't bother to install. There were broken tool parts left in the machine, including a bit of plastic from a probably dropped and cracked lithium battery and a short length of a rattail file that had obviously been misused as an alignment tool and had snapped off.

It’s probably not too prevalent, but I think it’s just a matter of time for all vehicles. For someone that doesn’t abuse theirs on the trail. It will just take a lot more miles. At minimum I would remove the stock bolts and put in some grade 12.9 bolts
 
bumperm

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What snuff said, socket head 12.9 bolts with a good thick quality washer.
So the question remains (at least in my active brain cell limited head). I guess the stock bolt is a flange head M10-1.25 X 25mm long bolt, so being as I'll be using a cap head bolt, a washer will be added to make up for the non-flange head. I'll make the washers on the lathe so can make them whatever thickness. To insure max thread engagement, should I order 30 mm length cap heads?

Yeah, I know I'm overthinking this. 🤔
 
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GPR1500SC

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Let’s go ride stony lonesome after we fix this motor mount. It’s a local park around here. It won’t take but a couple hours to fix it. Show up on Friday afternoon and we’ll fix it that evening then ride Saturday and you can return Sunday.
My motor isn't broken how do I get a invite?





I am not serious I am to busy, but it would almost be worth a broken motor mount to get a weekend ride with you and Snuff, and Adam.
 
joeymt33

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So the question remains (at least in my active brain cell limited head). I guess the stock bolt is a flange head M10-1.25 X 25mm long bolt, so being as I'll be using a cap head bolt, a washer will be added to make up for the non-flange head. I'll make the washers on the lathe so can make them whatever thickness. To insure max thread engagement, should I order 30 mm length cap heads?

Yeah, I know I'm overthinking this.

You can go ahead and order the 30 mm length and if it bottoms out then you could reduce the length yourself
 
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tjoreo

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So the question remains (at least in my active brain cell limited head). I guess the stock bolt is a flange head M10-1.25 X 25mm long bolt, so being as I'll be using a cap head bolt, a washer will be added to make up for the non-flange head. I'll make the washers on the lathe so can make them whatever thickness. To insure max thread engagement, should I order 30 mm length cap heads?

Yeah, I know I'm overthinking this. 🤔
I just looked at Mcmaster and it looks like they have some thicker metric washers that might work, since you are ordering bolts anyways. Says 4.5-5.4mm thickness so that should take up what you need.

Mcmaster Carr
 
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Haldog77

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I would stop and take a trip to Alabama, most EZ outs are very hard and if you try to drill them out, the bit will just go sideways and into the aluminum case. That's just my experience. This ceramic coated rod does intrigue me.
That's what I'm thinking Smitty. Load that someb**** up and get to north Alabama. It ain't that far from Little Rock. If @joeymt33 is willing to do the deed, then get that machine to him. No homo.

#NTC
 
Remington

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That's what I'm thinking Smitty. Load that someb**** up and get to north Alabama. It ain't that far from Little Rock. If @joeymt33 is willing to do the deed, then get that machine to him. No homo.

#NTC
Speaking of which….

@RingMaster
what ever happened to this situation?
Its ben 6months now and you never came back with results to Finnish the thread
 
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Haldog77

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Speaking of which….

@RingMaster
what ever happened to this situation?
Its ben 6months now and you never came back with results to Finnish the thread
@Remington I just looked up @RingMaster and he was last seen Tuesday of last week. He has made no posts since this thread. I would also like to know the outcome of his machine.
 
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Remington

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@Remington I just looked up @RingMaster and he was last seen Tuesday of last week. He has made no posts since this thread. I would also like to know the outcome of his machine.
Yes sir. Seen that also.
Would be nice to see what the end result was.
Too many start a thread and never come back with results to help others with the same issue
 
RingMaster

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Ok, guys . . . you got me. Everytime I think about this I'm on my phone and I want to get to a real keyboard so I can type a lot. And boy do I have an addition to my story. Anyway here goes.

I had a good friend call in favor with one of his friends that knows a lot more about welding than me. I took my machine to his shop and left it for the week. Abracadabra - he removed them both! I think his knowledge of welding and better tools did the trick. He said one thing that I didn't try was to be sure that the material is very clean before welding. I never bothered cleaning it. He also said that he needed to weld the nut on, then wait overnight for it to cool off before trying to unscrew it. He had more trouble with the one that was more resecessed than the other. And he said he had to try several times too.

He used this trick to hold the nut when he started welding. I tried needle nose pliers. This would have helpd me.

Imagejpeg 1


Here it is right after he hit it. I wasn't getting the whole nut red hot like he did. I'm sure that makes a difference too.

Imagejpeg 1 1



So, once he got the broken bolts out, I didn't want to put soft ones back in.

I found these bolts in the "speciality" section at home depot. They only had 30mm and 40mm. The Honda part number I show measured below was 25mm. However, they were 8.8 grade. The Honda part does not show what grade it is. I didn't to use these. I managed to find some grade 12.9 at Autozone. I bought 6 of them to share 4 with my two friends that also have P1000's. <<MORE ON THIS LATER>> So, try auto parts stores. I bet they will have what you need.

20230716 122104


That got my machine back in excellent working order. I had new, 12.9 grade bolts and life is good. I gave the stronger bolts to my buddys and told them to be sure to replace their soft honda bolts with the 12.9. But did, they do it? No . . .

And now... my buddy had the same problem! His factory bolts broke just like mine did. His machine is in my shop right now. And we are fighting the same problem again. His front bolt was not recessed and we were able to cut a slot and use a flathead screwdriver to get it out. But it wasn't without a lot of cussing. It was stuck in there good. We finally got it to budge with some heat from a propane torch, but it still took several hours of working it back and forth with lots of penetrating oil to get it out that way. Now, on to the recessed one.

That's a lot harder. He tried drilling, and then drilling slightly larger, then slightly larger using left handed bits. That got a good hole drilled in it. Then he used a good sized extractor. Of course it was seized in there and didn't budge. Unfortunately, he kept trying and then heard a SNAP. And now the story get's worse. Now his case around that bolt has two cracks in it and the bolt is still seized in it. Major bummer.

So, he's on to trying the Hess mount with only one 12.9 bolt in the front. However, just a few minutes ago, he told me that Hess informed him that it is is on back order and an undetermined delivery date. We don't know what to do now.

If your bolts are not broken and you sometimes hit rocks with the bottom of your machine, my suggestion is to take your bolts out NOW and replace it with 12.9 grade bolts and a good coating of anti-seize lubricant!

Good luck!
 
Stevo

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Ok, guys . . . you got me. Everytime I think about this I'm on my phone and I want to get to a real keyboard so I can type a lot. And boy do I have an addition to my story. Anyway here goes.

I had a good friend call in favor with one of his friends that knows a lot more about welding than me. I took my machine to his shop and left it for the week. Abracadabra - he removed them both! I think his knowledge of welding and better tools did the trick. He said one thing that I didn't try was to be sure that the material is very clean before welding. I never bothered cleaning it. He also said that he needed to weld the nut on, then wait overnight for it to cool off before trying to unscrew it. He had more trouble with the one that was more resecessed than the other. And he said he had to try several times too.

He used this trick to hold the nut when he started welding. I tried needle nose pliers. This would have helpd me.

View attachment 416612

Here it is right after he hit it. I wasn't getting the whole nut red hot like he did. I'm sure that makes a difference too.

View attachment 416614


So, once he got the broken bolts out, I didn't want to put soft ones back in.

I found these bolts in the "speciality" section at home depot. They only had 30mm and 40mm. The Honda part number I show measured below was 25mm. However, they were 8.8 grade. The Honda part does not show what grade it is. I didn't to use these. I managed to find some grade 12.9 at Autozone. I bought 6 of them to share 4 with my two friends that also have P1000's. <<MORE ON THIS LATER>> So, try auto parts stores. I bet they will have what you need.

View attachment 416607

That got my machine back in excellent working order. I had new, 12.9 grade bolts and life is good. I gave the stronger bolts to my buddys and told them to be sure to replace their soft honda bolts with the 12.9. But did, they do it? No . . .

And now... my buddy had the same problem! His factory bolts broke just like mine did. His machine is in my shop right now. And we are fighting the same problem again. His front bolt was not recessed and we were able to cut a slot and use a flathead screwdriver to get it out. But it wasn't without a lot of cussing. It was stuck in there good. We finally got it to budge with some heat from a propane torch, but it still took several hours of working it back and forth with lots of penetrating oil to get it out that way. Now, on to the recessed one.

That's a lot harder. He tried drilling, and then drilling slightly larger, then slightly larger using left handed bits. That got a good hole drilled in it. Then he used a good sized extractor. Of course it was seized in there and didn't budge. Unfortunately, he kept trying and then heard a SNAP. And now the story get's worse. Now his case around that bolt has two cracks in it and the bolt is still seized in it. Major bummer.

So, he's on to trying the Hess mount with only one 12.9 bolt in the front. However, just a few minutes ago, he told me that Hess informed him that it is is on back order and an undetermined delivery date. We don't know what to do now.

If your bolts are not broken and you sometimes hit rocks with the bottom of your machine, my suggestion is to take your bolts out NOW and replace it with 12.9 grade bolts and a good coating of anti-seize lubricant!

Good luck!
do you know what torque the bolts should be ? Also do you think the bolts break because of the machine bouncing over rocks, original bolts are defected, bolts torqued to high from factory stressing them from the get go. Would like to see a poll on how many pk1000 owners have had this issue. Would definitely change mine but wonder if I would break the factory bolts just trying to remove them.
 
Remington

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Would like to see a poll on how many pk1000 owners have had this issue.
You can always start a new thread on this and select “Poll” and it will generate one on the thread.

That said, I think youll be disappointed tho..
All the yrs on here, have only heard of 2 or 3 and its been for various reasons not the same.
Even the search doesn't have much but those couple
 
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