P1000 P1K5Dave's TTC 3" Lift and Fox Shock Install

[P1K5Dave]

So, overall thoughts on the Texas Tough Customs 3" arm lift:

Excellent build quality, and the ability to dial in my camber was something sorely missing on the Highlifter kit that was on there before.

Great customer service.

A bit pricier than the competition, but definitely worth it. These things are tough.

You get a real, full 3" of lift from the a-arms, with no brackets in your suspension messing up your shock geometry. Some of the other kits, (I've been warned) don't actually give you 3".

Really happy I went with the 2-bolt upper a-arm option, even though it took a bit more work to install (especially since I didn't do the welds myself.) I tore a tab earlier this year when I clipped a log along the trail. Fortunately, I was able to get it straightened out and welded by a professional frame guy, so everything came out fine. But those upper tab holes were a bit egged-out when I bought it used, as it had run around with loose nuts on those long bolts for a while. I was able to go tougher and tighter with this twin-bolt setup. As mentioned earlier, they're two 12mm bolts vs the single, long 10mm bolt you have with stock.

I was originally just going to go with black powder coat, as I'm kind of a keep-it-simple guy with the undercarriage stuff. But I saw a pic on the TTC site of a white Pioneer with white arms, and I liked the look! I'm glad I went with them. Most of the time, they're mud brown anyway...

I already mentioned everything I had issues with on the TTC install, and if you're prepared going in you'll have no problems.

In summary, highly recommended. While I initally balked at the price, I (fortunately) went with the old "cry now, not later" philosophy when choosing Texas Tough Customs arms.

 

[Admin]

 

[P1K5Dave]

Now, about those 814 Trail Series shocks: The story isn't so good there.

I was initially trying to do this suspension build on a lower budget, and chose the 814s mostly because people said they were cheaper but everyone still seemed to be very happy with them.

As you recall, I changed my mind midstream and chose to go with the higher-end (TTC) a-arms. I should have done the same thing with shocks, but opted to go ahead and try these.

First off, assembly was frustrating. The instructions tell you that the part numbers for front and rear are on the box, but not on the shocks themselves. If you just start unboxing stuff to pre-assemble the shocks, you may find that you don't know which is front and which is rear because they're all out of the box.

Great.

So I place a call to 814 suspension. It's about 2:58 pm Eastern time. I get a voicemail that their business hours are 10 am to 3 pm (?) and that if you need after hours support, send an email. I sent an email, and to this date have never received a response.

Fortunately, I remembered @DDDonkey did a video on the 814 install, and it turns out, he had the same problem I did. The rear shock has the longer eye. Through his video, I also learned that the spring weights are different, and they're marked on the box and on the spring. Mine were 350 lbs on the front, 400 on the rear. BUT THE INSTRUCTIONS MAKE NO MENTION OF THIS. I could have put them anywhere had I not watched DDDonkey's video. That annoyed me.

Depending on your arms, the hardware you get with the 814s is unlikely to fit the bill. You'll probably be making trips to the hardware store to get spacing washers. For example, measuring my stock rear shock, I found the lower eye sleeve measures 1.41" and the upper eye sleeve measured 1.25". The 814s ship with everything the same length (or width, depending on how you look at it.) For my case, I had to do a LOT of spacing to mate them up to the TTC arms.

 

[P1K5Dave]

After I watched DDDonkey's install video, I watched his follow-up about limiter straps and articulation, and immediately felt that twinge of buyers remorse in my gut.

Now, I know you're not supposed to articulate as much as these 814s will allow without limiter straps on (and you'd most certainly destroy these shocks if you did, not to mention probably your CV joints) but it did get me thinking about how much articulation I may lose over a higher-quality shock option without limiter straps.

I had taken off my rear sway bar last month, in preparation for the TTC lift install. Removal is required for these arms, and I wanted to run around on my old setup without it for a while to see how much different it was. I really liked the extra articulation I gained with the sway bar gone.

The limiter straps are a pain to have in there, in your install, in the first place. But this week, I had my first limiter-strap-limiting-fun moment. It was a simple, lame little tilted incline, and I was in turf mode. I was putting along, twisted the suspension, and was stopped by a spinning right rear tire that had lost traction.

I had to get out to look at it just to verify that it really had, in fact, lost traction due to the limiter strap. Unbelievable. It just wasn't much of a tilt. Of course, I was able to switch to 2WD lock and keep going, but that was really annoying. Again, LAME is the word that comes to mind. I'll try to run that trail again, see if I can get a repeat failure, and get a pic of it.

So in summary, these shocks aren't for me. I now realize that most of the people who love them probably ride dirt roads as the extent of their "off roading." I don't consider myself a hardcore banger out there, but probably more like a trail / rough trail rider.

I'll probably run these for a while, and then get ready to upgrade and sell them off with a few hundred miles on them.

 

[P1K5Dave]

If you're still reading after all this... I hope I was able to add some value to anyone considering going with either of these options. The thread could use more pics, so let me know anything you want to see and I'll get some more up.

I'm sure there are more things I want to pass on about the installation, or the performance of the upgrades, but that's all I can think of tonight. I'll drop in more thoughts as they pop up.

 

[ToddACimer]

Good detailed write up. Always interesting to see someone turn on what the internet claims is great but looks like a joke to those that know. I couldn't agree with you more about the half ass long bolts, limit straps and lack of rebound or jounce bumpers. 814s aren't for me but I just like to have fun.

 

[chucksmith0706]

Buggy looks awesome. A lot of useful information in there. Very detailed.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[P1K5Dave]

Yeah, it was the fb crowd, especially, that just raved on and on about the 814s. I ditched fb after the censorship stuff, so I won't be back there busting on their bandwagon.

I'm sure they're ok for some, but I'm disappointed.

 

[P1K5Dave]

Here's the pic of the lower mount spacing I had to do to mount the 814 shocks. One washer on the inside on each side to prevent slop in the mount, and TWO washers on the outside on each side because the supplied bolts are not threaded far enough.

In any install, you're not going to be able to bolt these up without all that outside spacing because the nut won't thread down that far.

 

[ToddACimer]

Here's the pic of the spacing I had to do to mount the 814 shocks. One washer on the inside on each side to prevent slop in the mount, and TWO washers on the outside on each side because the supplied bolts are not threaded far enough.

In any install, you're not going to be able to bolt these up without all that outside spacing because the nut won't thread down that far.

View attachment 283341

I hate the idea of using a long threaded bolt like that to take the shock loads. Your setup looks a lot better than most with the smaller diameter bushings but that stackup of washers and spacers is a joke to install..

 

[P1K5Dave]

Forgot to mention - the right front shock is squeaking like a m'fer. I need to dig in and check if it's in the mount or the shock itself, but my initial inspection tells me it's the actual shock squealing. Defect? I don't know, but if it's the shock, they'll be getting a call.

 

[P1K5Dave]

I hate the idea of using a long threaded bolt like that to take the shock loads. Your setup looks a lot better than most with the smaller diameter bushings but that stackup of washers and spacers is a joke to install..

That pic is just to show the spacing as I put it together. The limiter strap goes on the outside end of that nut, with another locking nut securing it in place. On the top rear mounts, you have to put almost an inch of spacing there before the limiter strap, to get it out past the frame tab that blocks it. Ugly.

 

[P1K5Dave]

I contacted Craig at 814.

Regarding the squeaking shock, he advised me to take the rebound setting down two clicks on the offending shock and run it for 50-100 miles before bringing it back to setting. Apparently, it's a break-in kind of thing. I'll give it a try.

Also, apparently there was a piece of white paper in the shock or spring box that mentioned spring weights and making sure you identify them and put the heavier ones in the back. He said it's not mentioned in the instructions because they ship different spring weights to different buyers depending on usage.

 

[tdhanses]

Starting with the Texas Tough Customs 3" lift kit, some installation lessons learned:

First off, Jared is top-notch in customer service. I called him several times with questions and thoughts, and he always answered right away, was really helpful, and actually encouraged me to call him again with anything I need. Seriously, amazing customer service. I don't know how the guy finds the time.

The shock mounting tabs are spaced 1.5" apart, whereas I think stock is closer to 1.4" (remember, the only stock arms I had were the rear uppers.) Something to note when you're planning your installation, you may need some spacing washers.

The ball joints are actually tie rod ends for a 1-ton truck. He gives you all the part numbers you need to buy replacement joints, available at your local auto parts store.
Upper Ball Joints - Moog ES2848LT
Lower Ball Joints - Moog ES437L
Inner Tie Rod Ends - SATV T4571
Outer Tie Rod Ends - Moog ES80558

Most of them are in the $25-$30 range if you buy them online. Beware, though, they're not really common ones. I checked 3 parts stores in my area, and only AutoZone had one upper ball joint in stock. Everything else had to be ordered by everyone.

The great thing about these upper and lower ball joints is that they thread into the a-arms via the mounting stud, there is no pressing-in of ball joints on the TTC arms. That will make life a lot easier on swapping them out, especially on the trail. You just need something to help with extracting the tapered stud, but you have that with any a-arm. During pre-assembly, I had to pop them in and out a few times and was able to do so just by lifting up and tapping the hub near the stud with a hammer. I'm not sure how well that'll work after they set in for a long time, so I bought one of these:
View attachment 283308
Yeah, it's probably going to jack up your boot trying to get it off, but if it's old and being replaced, who cares... Otherwise, if I need to take them out for any other reason, I'll try the hammer-tap method.

I was able to get tierod end replacements from rock auto dirt cheap, might check there.

 

[P1K5Dave]

Well, after 4 weeks I made the switch to the Fox shocks, thanks to the good deal find by @TripleB

I actually got the Fox's for $98 less than I paid for the 814s, and it's a far superior shock for my style of riding. Fitment is 100% better, and I'm finally where I expected to be on this suspension build.

I guess my style of riding should be described as "rough trail to very-rough trail," a bit out of the intended range of the 814s. I see people doing extreme stuff with their machines, and I never really think what I do is all that rough in comparison.

 

[P1K5Dave]

I'll get some height numbers later this afternoon to be posted tomorrow, but I was amazed how little I had to preload these vs the 814s. I may even back off the front a bit, as I'm at plenty of ride height on this TTC setup.

 

[P1K5Dave]

An interesting hiccup on installing the front shocks: They were very tight to install. I had to completely back off the preload so the spring was loose, put in the top bolt, and then with the arm at full droop the shock was still 1/4" longer than the bottom bolt holes.

I had to use a pry bar to compress the shock to get the bolt in. Did anyone else have this experience, or perhaps it was a function of my TTC arms?

The rear shocks bolted in easily.

 

[TripleB]

An interesting hiccup on installing the front shocks: They were very tight to install. I had to completely back off the preload so the spring was loose, put in the top bolt, and then with the arm at full droop the shock was still 1/4" longer than the bottom bolt holes.

I had to use a pry bar to compress the shock to get the bolt in. Did anyone else have this experience, or perhaps it was a function of my TTC arms?

The rear shocks bolted in easily.

I dont remember. All I can remember is I put my rears on the wrong side and my reservoirs damaged my break lines. I got lucky on that dumbass move.

 

[JenElio]

An interesting hiccup on installing the front shocks: They were very tight to install. I had to completely back off the preload so the spring was loose, put in the top bolt, and then with the arm at full droop the shock was still 1/4" longer than the bottom bolt holes.

I had to use a pry bar to compress the shock to get the bolt in. Did anyone else have this experience, or perhaps it was a function of my TTC arms?

The rear shocks bolted in easily.

Maybe like a built in limit strap type thing? 🤷‍♂️

 

[tdhanses]

An interesting hiccup on installing the front shocks: They were very tight to install. I had to completely back off the preload so the spring was loose, put in the top bolt, and then with the arm at full droop the shock was still 1/4" longer than the bottom bolt holes.

I had to use a pry bar to compress the shock to get the bolt in. Did anyone else have this experience, or perhaps it was a function of my TTC arms?

The rear shocks bolted in easily.

Think it’s your arms, I didn’t have to do that. If you think they are good with the factory springs just wait till you ditch their progressive springs.

 

[P1K5Dave]

Ditch their progressive springs? I don't follow...