Public land and access

[Jediwrathchild]

I hear ya on that. I'm 31 as well. I have 7 years until I can retire and not be moved every few years. I'll keep working, but it'll be on my terms. Hanging in the garden, selling at the farmers markets, and tying flies (I'm nowhere near the level to tie commercially at this point though).

 

[Admin]

 

[JTW]

I hear ya on that. I'm 31 as well. I have 7 years until I can retire and not be moved every few years. I'll keep working, but it'll be on my terms. Hanging in the garden, selling at the farmers markets, and tying flies (I'm nowhere near the level to tie commercially at this point though).

I take it you're military? I like you're plan!! Maybe we can buy adjoining properties and you can have run of mine when I'm not there.. lol

 

[Jediwrathchild]

This guy is a con. I know of a few public lands own and run by states and the public can access it with no trouble. The public lands will alway remain. It will just be managed by the states rather than the federal government. Which by the way do a lousy job.

Bears Ears... poeple can access it, ATV, hunt,camp get dead wood and run livestock on it. Now that obama made it a national monument,it will be roped off with a few walkinging paths and orental tourists in front and behind you by the thousands.

Keep allowing the corrupt government to do this and all fedural lands will be limited access. I'll take my chances with the states managing it any day. Besides you can make regulations , like the state can't sell it.

From what I've been reading, it's the R reps in Utah that are pushing for land transfers the hardest (yes other states are doing it as well) They placed several provisions and loopholes in the land use plan they pushed which allowed for much more mineral extraction, and backed heavily by big oil lobbyists. No-one can tell me that major corporations being involved in the acquisition of land is for the greater good of the American populous or for responsible management of nature and the environment.

I can't say I've ever had issue with access to federal lands. It's typically been the state land that can't afford to do road maintenance to keep places open. There were roads in on the Olympic Peninsula that were closed for damn near all 5 years I lived in Port Angeles, WA. Yes I could access it, but it added dozens of miles to get to a trailhead. And half the time the trails were in a very poor state. When the feds grant leases, it's seems strictly regulated and access isn't restricted. Yes, the feds could use improvement in their management, but I have very little faith the state can do any better, or that they would put in provisions preventing sale to private entities.

Utah is graced with lots of wide open space. I've lived in a place that is 99% privatized due to greed by politicians in the name of shortsighted money making. The damage is irreversible, access completely prohibited or price gouged and not a place I ever want to live again. I think it takes living in both environments to really appreciate how important keeping access open is.

 

[Jediwrathchild]

I take it you're military? I like you're plan!! Maybe we can buy adjoining properties and you can have run of mine when I'm not there.. lol

Sounds fantastic! hah Yup, 13 years in the Coast Guard. Very grateful for the experience and cool stuff I've done. But, it'll be amazing to actually settle into a place and not have my stuff getting broken by the movers every few years! hah

 

[JTW]

Sounds fantastic! hah Yup, 13 years in the Coast Guard. Very grateful for the experience and cool stuff I've done. But, it'll be amazing to actually settle into a place and not have my stuff getting broken by the movers every few years! hah

What do you do for the CG?

 

[Jediwrathchild]

What do you do for the CG?

I do Avionics and Electrical on the H-65 helicopters. Also a Flight Mechanic and Aircrew Instructor. Here in Kodiak I'm attached to ALPAT (Alaska Patrol) we deploy on the CG ships into to Gulf, Bering and Arctic doing search and rescue and fisheries enforcement. Definitely the coolest mission and place I've been. I think theres a few other guys on the forum in the CG up here on C-130s and H-60s.

 

[Manwell]

Interesting thread and not to get political, but it is political. So, it's interesting to me that people who live near the Federally owned property and have full access and a great place to play, don't mind plundering my treasure at the point of a gun to have that luxury. The Federal Government owns 28% of the land in the United States - a bit much in my opinion. Besides, have you heard the news that the federal government is $20 Trillion in operational debt with over has over $200 Trillion in unfunded federal mandates? I get that the Federal Government needs to own and manage land, but 28%? The feds just grabbed another 553 million acres in Southeast Utah, against the overwhelming wishes of local government and people.

My questions are these: Where does it end, how much land should the Federal Government own? If you live in a state and don't care to pay for the cost of the area you want to play in, what makes you think I want to pay for it?

Lastly - I think you and everyone who serves for your service and sacrifice - it is significat!

 

[Jediwrathchild]

It's definitely political, but it is applicable and affects what we all do around here. Land use in the west and the conservation of it has been a huge deal since as long as I can remember. Until recently, didn't realize there is a very real movement that wants to take it. There has been zero "grabbing" of land from the states. The federal gov't has owned it since the beginning. The states at granting of statehood were each given many many millions of acres.Which in the video series attached above shows how little of that land is still under state control. It's all been privatized.

I see it completely opposite of you @Manwell , these federal lands are being taken at gunpoint from US citizens by state politicians for benefit to their oil buddies. Its a very shortsighted budget solution if the underlying goal is to sell it to private entities. Before I left the previous place I lived, one of the few state parks left was shutting down. There was discussion of selling it off to a developer to put in an amusement park or casino or some other garbage. It probably sold to some guy that made it his deer hunting property, another place I couldn't go. I assure you in a place that is less than .5% public land, the outcry was not positive from the locals.

We do pay for it, in our federal taxes. And I am happy to continue paying, even to support public land in places I may never ever go to. These places generate revenue for local economies and the industries that revolve around the ability to recreate on them (biking, hiking, ATV, hunting, fishing, outfitters etc) Shoot, I have ten of thousands wrapped up in gear and toys that get used in the open public spaces. When the state runs out of money and inevitably sells it off, it'll be to a company that short term may bolster a local economy until the minerals they're selling to other countries runs out. But after that, the land has no value since its been dug up and probably polluted. Hocking priceless family heirlooms to pay the cable TV bill is not the answer. Cancelling cable and picking up a book is probably a lot more positive anyway.

I don't advocate the feds gaining more (they're not) I advocate keeping what we have healthy, sustainable and open.

Anyway, I get fired up. Probably time to get back to talking about Pioneers and what not.

 

[tjoreo]

This guy is a con. I know of a few public lands own and run by states and the public can access it with no trouble. The public lands will alway remain. It will just be managed by the states rather than the federal government. Which by the way do a lousy job.

Bears Ears... poeple can access it, ATV, hunt,camp get dead wood and run livestock on it. Now that obama made it a national monument,it will be roped off with a few walkinging paths and orental tourists in front and behind you by the thousands.

Keep allowing the corrupt government to do this and all fedural lands will be limited access. I'll take my chances with the states managing it any day. Besides you can make regulations , like the state can't sell it.

Frequently Asked Questions | Trust Lands Administration

Are trust lands public lands?

No. Although trust lands support select public institutions, trust lands are not public lands. Trust lands were allocated specifically to generate revenue to support designated state institutions, including public schools, hospitals, teaching colleges, and universities. While approximately 67% of Utah is open for public access and recreation, SITLA manages about 6% of the state’s acreage for its beneficiaries, which are primarily public schools.

I guess the State of Utah is just being nice by letting you use these lands. Like all the rest these lands are NOT public. They are trust lands to benefit the state.

I like everyone else agrees the federal government doesn't manage these lands to the best of their ability, but most everyone I know believes the state can't manage them any better.

Jedi made a comment earlier that hit home. This is the biggest land grab in his lifetime. It will be the biggest rip-off in my kids lifetime. I'm just afraid what they will be left with when they get old enough.

 

[Montecresto]

Wow, I feel a little sick to my stomach that a Senator would actually say that. But given the current state of US politics, I'm not surprised. I'll be getting involved in fighting these land transfers. If it goes through, this will likely be the biggest theft from the American people in my lifetime.

Gary Johnson was the best bet in this regard for sure. An avid outdoorsman, has climbed every 14ner in North America, backpacked most it's trails, cross country bicycled, and ran scores of marathons. You'd never see him allowing such transfers. Trump on the other hand has never even taken a walk through our NP's. He's a dollar and cents guy. You can be sure that if business wants their hands on our public lands, Trump won't be the protectorate thereof.

 

[JTW]

Gary Johnson was the best bet in this regard for sure. An avid outdoorsman, has climbed every 14ner in North America, backpacked most it's trails, cross country bicycled, and ran scores of marathons. You'd never see him allowing such transfers. Trump on the other hand has never even taken a walk through our NP's. He's a dollar and cents guy. You can be sure that if business wants their hands on our public lands, Trump won't be the protectorate thereof.

Don't start with that crap again... it's simple. We're 20 trillion in debt and something must happen. I'm a huge States rights kinda guy but I see Jedi's point. And I could argue it either way. There's no telling what Trump will do, so don't speculate because because he's not your guy. With regard to the 28% ownership by the Feds.. great! There are tons of places across the west where big money is buying it all.. we little folks wouldn't have access if it weren't for the federal lands. Truth is.. we could use another population reducer like the flu or the plague.

 

[Montecresto]

Don't start with that crap again... it's simple. We're 20 trillion in debt and something must happen. I'm a huge States rights kinda guy but I see Jedi's point. And I could argue it either way. There's no telling what Trump will do, so don't speculate because because he's not your guy. With regard to the 28% ownership by the Feds.. great! There are tons of places across the west where big money is buying it all.. we little folks wouldn't have access if it weren't for the federal lands. Truth is.. we could use another population reducer like the flu or the plague.

Not sure what population reduction or the ND have to do with anything I said. But this is a public forum and you're not the one deciding what opinions are expressed.

 

[Jediwrathchild]

So many people in the country really have no idea how vast and accessible the western states are.So these types of things aren't anywhere own their radar. Their attitude is, "sure, sell off 3 million acres they have another 40 million".People don't care because this discussion is driven towards western states. Guess what, they want what little is left of OH, AL, PA, KY etc too. Ppl come to visit me here in Kodiak and they are blown away. And really, theres places in OR, WA and CA that are just as accessible and amazing! I think if people saw and understood they would see the value, even if they don't live anywhere near these areas. I think most would agree that saving National Parks is a given, but theres some amazing country that really isn't protected by anything.

Hopefully this thread got people to research or opened peoples eyes to what is happening. I know I definitely got some very good info. If you're concerned, contact your reps and senators. I'll be spending this weekend contacting Sen Stevens and Murkowski, and Rep Zinke. I'll also be joining the various land advocacy groups, because 20 bucks to them or another name on their petition can make a difference.

If you're a member of the outdoor community we need your help! This will impact the rest of the country and you could lose what little public land is left in the Midwest, Southeast and Northeast.

 

[JTW]

Not sure what population reduction or the ND have to do with anything I said. But this is a public forum and you're not the one deciding what opinions are expressed.

You're so sensitive when it comes to Johnson.. you have a man crush on him or what?
The point of population reduction is simple. Less people less issues and resources needed. If you've read the thread you know how the national debt ties into the issues being discussed here. You bringing Gary Johnson into the conversation adds nothing to the conversation. He's not even a player in the maters at hand.

 

[Montecresto]

So many people in the country really have no idea how vast and accessible the western states are.So these types of things aren't anywhere own their radar. Their attitude is, "sure, sell off 3 million acres they have another 40 million".People don't care because this discussion is driven towards western states. Guess what, they want what little is left of OH, AL, PA, KY etc too. Ppl come to visit me here in Kodiak and they are blown away. And really, theres places in OR, WA and CA that are just as accessible and amazing! I think if people saw and understood they would see the value, even if they don't live anywhere near these areas. I think most would agree that saving National Parks is a given, but theres some amazing country that really isn't protected by anything.

Hopefully this thread got people to research or opened peoples eyes to what is happening. I know I definitely got some very good info. If you're concerned, contact your reps and senators. I'll be spending this weekend contacting Sen Stevens and Murkowski, and Rep Zinke. I'll also be joining the various land advocacy groups, because 20 bucks to them or another name on their petition can make a difference.

If you're a member of the outdoor community we need your help! This will impact the rest of the country and you could lose what little public land is left in the Midwest, Southeast and Northeast.

Totally agree. I am a member of several out door groups, backpacking clubs and environmental groups, I support the cause of public lands and their access and I do so with my wallet, signing petitions and most importantly with my vote.

 

[Montecresto]

You're so sensitive when it comes to Johnson.. you have a man crush on him or what?
The point of population reduction is simple. Less people less issues and resources needed. If you've read the thread you know how the national debt ties into the issues being discussed here. You bringing Gary Johnson into the conversation adds nothing to the conversation. He's not even a player in the maters at hand.

No, I'm sensitive with regards to rudeness. And Gary Johnson will run again and he's still in this discussion, it's not confined to the sxs forum.

 

[JTW]

No, I'm sensitive with regards to rudeness. And Gary Johnson will run again and he's still in this discussion, it's not confined to the sxs forum.

Who was being rude? Pointing out that you're hijacking a thread to boast about a candidate that didn't and can't win.. why? Why turn a good thread into another political s*** show? Yes, I get the politics involved in the federal lands debate but Gary Johnson has nothing to do with this.. He's a has been and it will not mater if he runs again. How about we keep this on point and not skew off subject.

 

[Montecresto]

Who was being rude? Pointing out that you're hijacking a thread to boast about a candidate that didn't and can't win.. why? Why turn a good thread into another political s*** show? Yes, I get the politics involved in the federal lands debate but Gary Johnson has nothing to do with this.. He's a has been and it will not mater if he runs again. How about we keep this on point and not skew off subject.

Yep, the point is public lands and their future, and how they can best be protected. Trump is the wrong answer to that question, and wishing for a plague to reduce population is irrelevant to federal protection of public land and just more of you're typical hatred. Jedi at least understands this must be done legislatively and requires individual participation, not bloviation.

 

[Montecresto]

So, with the recent multiple designation of millions of acres of wilderness areas and Monuments I started diving deeper into access to OUR public lands. I was concerned that these national
Monuments areas would restrict my ability to fish, hike hunt etc these areas. I learned gratefully that I will still be able to do these things.

I also read further about a Republican house bill that has passed which would return federally managed lands to the states. Of course this raised some very real concerns by me that states would not be able to manage them financially, and would cause sale to private companies for drilling, mining and other economic development with no regard to conservation or our access.

Living here in AK access isn't an issue, if I want to go up a hill, I find a game trail and wander on up. Albeit through devils club, alder and salmonberry thickets. Regardless, I can still go and recreate wherever I please.

You guys in the lower 48, has this been something you're concerned about? I plan to retire in or around Boise, and a big appeal of Idaho, is that nearly 70% of the state is public land.

Not tying to get political or anything like that, just curious what fellow outdoorsman, hunters and fisherman are dealing with near them.

Oregonians are fighting some heavy land battles presently and there are several petitions on line that can be signed with regards to this issue.

 

[tjoreo]

@Jediwrathchild Thank You very much for bringing this topic up. Today I was lucky enough to jump on my rig and enjoy these beautiful public lands that I sure wish everyone could enjoy. I was doing the same thinking that you just brought up, and that is this is only a problem for a few of us. The few on the west coast that have the liberty to enjoy them. We are truly very lucky and I sure wish everyone could enjoy them. This has been an issue I have been focused on for sometime, but your topic has brought more light on this item. I hope everyone takes the time to explore this issue, because it really is an issue for all. Thanks again. I know St. Maries is a beautiful place, but if you do ever make it to the boise area, look me up and I can show you some awesome sites in the Idaho desert.