P1000 Internal Gear Reduction not saving clutches

[PioneerPete]

The first clutch repair I have no idea what actually did it at 160 miles. The second was after 1000 miles and near the end 10 hrs of a 12 hr ride in Tackett Creek which also got the front axle.

I've learned my lesson figuring this machine out. I'm going to a 2017 1000-5 in Blue for the family and swapping my P500 for a 2017 1000-3 LE for my trail riding. Not doing any lifts, maybe go to true 27 x9 Roctane XD on front and 27x11 Roctane XD on rears. I almost never drag as it is losing 2" of ground clearance won't be that much different.

I hear you on the lift too... I had the highlifter for a few rides, but ended up going back to normal shock locations... it just seems more "right" that way... hard to explain, and I do miss the extra 2" some times (that's what she said @JTW ), but overall more content where it is now.

 

[Admin]

 

[Ridem32]

So far I love my PK5. But no way would I go buy a 2017 now that I know about clutches & seat hear issues. Just to much money not to be TOP NOTCH MACHINE


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[JTW]

Just seen where a guy who installed the internal gear reductions just burnt his clutch up again.

View attachment 31017

Not sure how big of tires he is running but I just don't believe these machines were made for extreme mudding that some people use them for. Especially with 30"+ tall tires.

I have only run the 28" x10" x 14" and have went through 2 clutches, a right rear axle and a left front axle. I don't even get into mud unless absolutely necessary. My point being, I wouldn't recommend throwing a ton of $$$ I to the P1K and expect it to do something it wasn't designed for with tires 30%+ bigger than OEM. It just isn't going to hold up, these machines weigh so much more than an ATV the stresses put on the drive train is going to let something give up the ghost.

Wtf?? I thought this was supposed to solve all those issues? Lol

 

[ghost]

This thread is a real downer. I refused to "like" some of those comments even though I agree.

As for the lift - if you add skids, roof, windshield etc and loose 2 inches due to the weight, wouldn't a 2 inch lift put the drive train components back to the stock angles where they were designed. Possibly reducing stress due to the machine sitting too low without the lift? I guess your talking about a lift that goes higher than design.

Just think out loud. Maybe I'm just trying to justify a purchase...

 

[hondabob]

The gear reduction should work great with 27" mud tires. 32's and 34's will gear it back up. For extreme mud and large tires the 2017 RZR 1000 with the 40% lower low range may be a good choice and it comes with 30" tires. A Highlifter model or Maverick Mud model may be good too. I hate belt drive and Polaris quality but for extreme mud riding it is a good choice. Its best to setup two of them so one is always ready to ride.

 

[Eltobgi]

Imo something needs to be done.if you can't ride in mud then you shouldn't be plowing either and it's a utility vehicle it should at least plow. Again reguadless of how someone is riding or the conditions set forth it shouldn't have any problems for awhile it's a Honda none of the others do. You should be able to get in and run through the gears without a worry but that's my opinion

Well I am in the process of changing my first clutch pack on the Beast, which happened while the snow plow was attached! I will admit that I got it stuck and shifted from reverse to drive over and over again until I was able to get out! I was thinking at that time that it might harm the clutches but was determined to get out. About 5 miles down the road began plowing a neighbors crossing...it was doing fine no issues...stopped for oncoming traffic...and pressed the pedal and nothing! I didn't expect to loose a clutch pack this way! Seemed to happen all of a sudden! But still can't say it was actually from plowing!

 

[JACKAL]

Are you expecting the 2017 clutches to be more reliable?

Yes.

 

[JACKAL]

Wtf?? I thought this was supposed to solve all those issues? Lol

So was this, advertised as a cure all too...

 

[hondabob]

Clutch failure sucks and belt drive sucks too. A much lower low range and reverse gear would prevent most clutch failure and would allow the next size larger tires. I run 28's but I'm very careful to get the rpm above 2,000 right away to avoid clutch slipping. I keep the rpm above 3,000 on my low speed driving. The 500 has super low gearing and that is what I would like for low range and reverse.

 

[Ridem32]

On a 1,000 type of machine you should not have to keep the rpms up high to drive a automatic to keep from burning clutches out. They have to engage with line pressure and Honda missed the mark on this. Could be a easy fix for a manufacturer. If the 2017 is trouble free with clutch issues they should have a repair for the 2016 models.


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[CumminsPusher]

On a 1,000 type of machine you should not have to keep the rpms up high to drive a automatic to keep from burning clutches out. They have to engage with line pressure and Honda missed the mark on this. Could be a easy fix for a manufacturer. If the 2017 is trouble free with clutch issues they should have a repair for the 2016 models.


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I fully agree! We shouldn't have to be driving it special to keep things from slipping. Some say there isn't a problem yet are quick to point out it has to be driven. That's a problem.

 

[cschomber63]

Just seen where a guy who installed the internal gear reductions just burnt his clutch up again.

View attachment 31017

Not sure how big of tires he is running but I just don't believe these machines were made for extreme mudding that some people use them for. Especially with 30"+ tall tires.

I have only run the 28" x10" x 14" and have went through 2 clutches, a right rear axle and a left front axle. I don't even get into mud unless absolutely necessary. My point being, I wouldn't recommend throwing a ton of $$$ I to the P1K and expect it to do something it wasn't designed for with tires 30%+ bigger than OEM. It just isn't going to hold up, these machines weigh so much more than an ATV the stresses put on the drive train is going to let something give up the ghost.

Some machines are so transformed they don't resemble the original at all. It's ridiculous. Buy a jacked 4x4


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[AKRider]

As I've said before, I'm going to drive it the way I want to. As others have said, you shouldn't need to give a 30 minute lesson to someone if you let them drive your machine. If mine burn up you can bet your @$$ it's going into the shop and Honda is going to hear about it. The more I hear about this, the more the words "class action" come to mind.

 

[AKRider]

Some machines are so transformed they don't resemble the original at all. It's ridiculous. Buy a jacked 4x4


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I've never lifted any machine I've owned. I don't plan on lifting this one, either. You're correct about many of the machines on the FB page. But, there's many that haven't done any of that stuff that have burned up clutches. Honda has an issue. They need to fix it.

 

[AKRider]

In fact, I'm to the point that of anyone would ask me my recommendation on this machine, I'm to the point of telling them to hold off until Honda gets their act together.

 

[CumminsPusher]

I've never lifted any machine I've owned. I don't plan on lifting this one, either. You're correct about many of the machines on the FB page. But, there's many that haven't done any of that stuff that have burned up clutches. Honda has an issue. They need to fix it.

If the 17 has no problems I'm going to be upset because that would mean they hung a few of us out to dry knowing there was an issue. That wouldn't be right for people to have spend yet more money and time upgrading to the following year to have dependability.
I do hope they are better for the sake of the Honda name but what about us 16's then?


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[AKRider]

If the 17 has no problems I'm going to be upset because that would mean they hung a few of us out to dry knowing there was an issue. That wouldn't be right for people to have spend yet more money and time upgrading to the following year to have dependability.
I do hope they are better for the sake of the Honda name but what about us 16's then?


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That would seriously piss me off. Again, class action comes to mind. The problem is getting everyone together. Some are already bailing on the machine. Some might not be documenting their issues with Honda because they did outrageous mods.

 

[hondabob]

Not much choice if a belt drive is out of the question. A belt drive with a wet clutch won't last very long either. For owners that need to keep the rpm at or under 1,800 rpm in my opinion the clutch won't last very long. It's about the same as stopping on a steep hill and using the throttle to keep it from rolling back. I have a couple of extremely low speed rides and I drive my Pioneer 700 so I can inch along with lots of stopping. I don't think we will see any change in the clutch but lower gearing may happen in the future.

 

[AKRider]

Not much choice if a belt drive is out of the question. A belt drive with a wet clutch won't last very long either. For owners that need to keep the rpm at or under 1,800 rpm in my opinion the clutch won't last very long. It's about the same as stopping on a steep hill and using the throttle to keep it from rolling back. I have a couple of extremely low speed rides and I drive my Pioneer 700 so I can inch along with lots of stopping. I don't think we will see any change in the clutch but lower gearing may happen in the future.

Probably what's kept me good. I always have the rpms up. If your working it, drive like a tractor. If you want speed, drive it like a race car.

 

[CumminsPusher]

Not much choice if a belt drive is out of the question. A belt drive with a wet clutch won't last very long either. For owners that need to keep the rpm at or under 1,800 rpm in my opinion the clutch won't last very long. It's about the same as stopping on a steep hill and using the throttle to keep it from rolling back. I have a couple of extremely low speed rides and I drive my Pioneer 700 so I can inch along with lots of stopping. I don't think we will see any change in the clutch but lower gearing may happen in the future.

Fully agree that lower gearing was needed. I'd put money the part numbers will line up on the 17. If there is any changes it'll be internally done to change pressures or better tolerances on the seats during manufacturing. At least in my opinion. We'll see I guess. Had reverse been separate from the transfer case gears like a truck wouldn't have hurt either, as it is right now reverse is somewhere in between low and high. You get in to trouble in low first and have to back out in medium reverse, that makes no sense.
For the record I haven't done changes to the drivetrain to effectively change the drive ratios and have driven the machine hard and easy and still having issues. Again my red one was great the white one not so much! Same driver same terrain same "roughness" different results. I've had both machines and know the difference. It's not the clutches.
I don't want to go back to belts however I'd like my Pioneer to be as dependable as my last one, I miss that. I love my rig just wish I didn't have to concern myself with the possibility of further issues


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