S
Man, I'd have to agree with this!! Thoroughly entertaining and enlightening build!! The talent on this forum is just amazing with yours being top notch with your mechanical and writing skills sir!!
Man, I'd have to agree with this!! Thoroughly entertaining and enlightening build!! The talent on this forum is just amazing with yours being top notch with your mechanical and writing skills sir!!
Since these new Pioneers are getting outrageous, I went with the "Bold New Graphics" option. These filled in the "blank space" on each side of the front fender. I took the original decals off long ago. Just thought it needed something in those spaces. So for $23 it looks like a later and more expensive model.
Thank You for your kind comments. I am happy to be able to share some of this with everyone here. This kind of stuff keeps me young at heart.
Another box checked on the never ending list of "things to do" for my PIONEER 1000-5D Just installed a full set of Rough Country M1 Coil overs. I was looking for a better ride and several other users have reported that they thought that these ride better than stock and definitely do not bust the bank account.
The installation was straight up. The most difficult part was "taking out" all the pre-load that these shocks come with from the factory. I found out that it is much easier to take preload out by lubing the adjusters and using a bench vise, before you install the shocks on the machine. You can adjust them on the machine; but just not as easily as you can on the bench. These units came with 3 1/2 inches of threads showing, so the spring preload was VERY High (Way too high for me). Rough Country claims these are intended to give "0" to 2" of lift over stock. This is accomplished using the wide range of preload adjustment, shocks are slightly longer than the sock units when fully extended and the body of the shock has a lot of threaded adjustment. Since I already had a STRONGMADE 2" bracket lift installed, I did not intend to use the shocks to raise the machine. This would allow me to run much less spring preload and should give me a softer ride. I set my initial FRONT Preload to 1/2" of threads showing on the preload collars and REAR preload to 1" of thread showing. My ride height was same as before and this preload setting gave me 1 inch of sag with normal load of 2 adults and all the gear that we carry. It is important that the preload is not set so high that the shocks are "topped out" when the machine is loaded to whatever your "normal" loadout will be. You need some sag or the ride will become too harsh. This is the problem with the original suspension, soft springs, excess compression damping and way too much preload all contribute to make the ride choppy and harsh.
The price of the units is great, no complaints there. Packaging was top notch. Shipping was fast and included in the purchase price. Bought direct from Rough Country website, since they had them in stock and could ship same day. I received them in 3 days. These units appear to be well made. Shock bodies are steel with a good looking zinc plated anti corrosive finish. Springs are finished in what appears to be a black powder coat paint. These are large diameter (46mm), mono-tube shocks. Shafts are hard chromed and they appear larger than stock. Bushings in both ends appear to be high quality with the steel inner sleeve molded into the rubber, just like OEM. The preload collars are aluminum and appear to be good quality. They sent a total of 4 lock nut spanners for adjusting preload lock nuts (I got 2 spanners for each shock in the box). These are not fancy, but they work. I am going to 3D Print some handles for these spanners as the edges of the metal tool are uncomfortably sharp and hard on the hands (a minor issue in my estimation).
Finally, I do not think that these units will compete with the 814's, FOX, ELKA or WER units in performance, but lets face it, almost anything is an improvement over the OEM dampers. . . . They SUCK! Bottom Line is that I simply refuse to pay $1500~ $3000 for a set of these high end brands, that would be 25~50% of what I gave for the entire machine to start with. These fit my budget, appear well built, have a good warranty and return policy and offer a wide range of preload adjustment along with a higher spring rate. I will reserve final judgement on these until we do our next ride, however, my initial impression of these is very good, the ride is noticeably smother on the rough terrain close to the house. A full on ride should answer that question. Time will tell, More to follow.
The installation was straight up. The most difficult part was "taking out" all the pre-load that these shocks come with from the factory. I found out that it is much easier to take preload out by lubing the adjusters and using a bench vise, before you install the shocks on the machine. You can adjust them on the machine; but just not as easily as you can on the bench. These units came with 3 1/2 inches of threads showing, so the spring preload was VERY High (Way too high for me). Rough Country claims these are intended to give "0" to 2" of lift over stock. This is accomplished using the wide range of preload adjustment, shocks are slightly longer than the sock units when fully extended and the body of the shock has a lot of threaded adjustment. Since I already had a STRONGMADE 2" bracket lift installed, I did not intend to use the shocks to raise the machine. This would allow me to run much less spring preload and should give me a softer ride. I set my initial FRONT Preload to 1/2" of threads showing on the preload collars and REAR preload to 1" of thread showing. My ride height was same as before and this preload setting gave me 1 inch of sag with normal load of 2 adults and all the gear that we carry. It is important that the preload is not set so high that the shocks are "topped out" when the machine is loaded to whatever your "normal" loadout will be. You need some sag or the ride will become too harsh. This is the problem with the original suspension, soft springs, excess compression damping and way too much preload all contribute to make the ride choppy and harsh.
The price of the units is great, no complaints there. Packaging was top notch. Shipping was fast and included in the purchase price. Bought direct from Rough Country website, since they had them in stock and could ship same day. I received them in 3 days. These units appear to be well made. Shock bodies are steel with a good looking zinc plated anti corrosive finish. Springs are finished in what appears to be a black powder coat paint. These are large diameter (46mm), mono-tube shocks. Shafts are hard chromed and they appear larger than stock. Bushings in both ends appear to be high quality with the steel inner sleeve molded into the rubber, just like OEM. The preload collars are aluminum and appear to be good quality. They sent a total of 4 lock nut spanners for adjusting preload lock nuts (I got 2 spanners for each shock in the box). These are not fancy, but they work. I am going to 3D Print some handles for these spanners as the edges of the metal tool are uncomfortably sharp and hard on the hands (a minor issue in my estimation).
Finally, I do not think that these units will compete with the 814's, FOX, ELKA or WER units in performance, but lets face it, almost anything is an improvement over the OEM dampers. . . . They SUCK! Bottom Line is that I simply refuse to pay $1500~ $3000 for a set of these high end brands, that would be 25~50% of what I gave for the entire machine to start with. These fit my budget, appear well built, have a good warranty and return policy and offer a wide range of preload adjustment along with a higher spring rate. I will reserve final judgement on these until we do our next ride, however, my initial impression of these is very good, the ride is noticeably smother on the rough terrain close to the house. A full on ride should answer that question. Time will tell, More to follow.
P
We have not been out for a ride. Holidays, a bad case of flu/upper respiratory infection and family issues have stalled our rides. I will report back as soon as we get the chance to get back on the trails for an extended ride.
P
S
Scrappapotamus
The Scrappapotamus
Lifetime Member
I spent about 8 hours to do the job. I removed 4” front, 4 1/2” center and 5”rear. The front cut was 4” above the junction, after removing the front joint, I chucked it in a lathe and cut off the remaining 4” of tube. This allowed the original joint to be rewelded to the cage at the original cut. the middle cut was directly above the center brace bar and the rear about 6” above the lower bend of the rear bar. I turned some short welding joints to slip inside the cut tubes for each set of cuts. These joints allowed easier welding and more strength.
we met mlynch001 and his wife on the trials at Magazine this last week, had a great visit and your Pioneer build is awsome! great job hope to see ya'll again in the near future!
Monte
Monte
This Item is posted in multiple threads. Followup on RC M1 Shocks, first big ride:
We finally got a break in the weather, home projects and health issues. We were able to take our P1K-5 out to get a long ride and evaluate the RC Shocks in detail. We rode about 70 miles at Mt. Magazine, AR; these are trails that were very familiar to us, so we could concentrate on getting a valid impression. These shocks work amazingly well, we immediately noticed that the machine does not chatter nearly as much over washboard roads. The machine us also less harsh over sharp edged bumps. The improvement is very evident.
The machine seems noticeably smoother over most bumps, however some additional preload may be needed. I believe that my initial preload "guestimate" was slightly low. However, that will be an easy fix. In addition, after 60 miles of initial break in, the ride height settled a bit, since all shocks will "settle" somewhat during break in. This allowed more sag than desired which in turn uses up more suspension travel. I will add some preload and re-test.
While these are not FOX, WE, ELKA or 814 Shocks, we were not anticipating that they would be. That being said, We still feel that the RC product is a good improvement over the stock shocks. One thing that needs to be considered is that these shocks do not have the "Self -Leveling" feature, this may be a deal breaker for some users. The adjustable preload and lift capability is worth the price alone. You can get 2" or so of lift without the disadvantage of a bracket lift changing the shock angles. These should ride better than stock shocks on a top mount bracket lift, if you reduce the preload.
The packaging of the product is very good and they arrived in good condition. There are tools provided in the box to adjust the preload, these tools are basic, but they do work. The very wide range of adjustment will also allow an additional 2" of lift for those who do not want to use a bracket lift. The user will need to experiment with the preload setting on their particular machine to get the best results. The instructions for adjusting preload are not well covered in the instructions or the install video, so the user is pretty much on their own. For preload adjustment, You Tube is your friend. If you bolt them on as they come out of the box, you are going to automatically get the additional full 2" of lift. Since I was not wanting additional lift from these shocks, the "as Shipped" preload was way too high. I reduced the preload down about 3" inches to benefit from the softer suspension.
These shocks and springs appear hefty and the finish looks good. The shafts are large and hard chromed. Shock bodies larger than stock and are bright zinc plated steel. Springs are nicely powder coated black. Threaded adjustment collars are provided for preload adjustment. According to RC, the damping is accomplished using bending shim washer stacks, which is a premium feature. No adjustment for Compression or Rebound are provided, but none was expected at this price point. Both ends of the shocks feature OEM style bushings. All stock hardware is reused.
In summary, for $700, I consider them a good value, especially for those who cannot justify or maybe cannot afford $2k-$3k, or more for full blown "race" shocks. We ARE NOT aggressive or fast riders, this factor needs to be taken in to consideration by the user. A fast or aggressive rider will probably not benefit from this product. The stock Pioneer Suspension geometry is the ultimate limiting factor, shocks cannot change that fact. If you are like us and simply want a noticeably "better than stock" ride and possibly some additional lift, then these shocks might be for you. These are, at least a good substitute for the OEM shocks. The only thing that I have not determined was the long term durability of the product. They do have a 3 year warranty, so that should be some protection against problems, going forward. Time will tell. Feel free to PM me if you have other questions.
We finally got a break in the weather, home projects and health issues. We were able to take our P1K-5 out to get a long ride and evaluate the RC Shocks in detail. We rode about 70 miles at Mt. Magazine, AR; these are trails that were very familiar to us, so we could concentrate on getting a valid impression. These shocks work amazingly well, we immediately noticed that the machine does not chatter nearly as much over washboard roads. The machine us also less harsh over sharp edged bumps. The improvement is very evident.
The machine seems noticeably smoother over most bumps, however some additional preload may be needed. I believe that my initial preload "guestimate" was slightly low. However, that will be an easy fix. In addition, after 60 miles of initial break in, the ride height settled a bit, since all shocks will "settle" somewhat during break in. This allowed more sag than desired which in turn uses up more suspension travel. I will add some preload and re-test.
While these are not FOX, WE, ELKA or 814 Shocks, we were not anticipating that they would be. That being said, We still feel that the RC product is a good improvement over the stock shocks. One thing that needs to be considered is that these shocks do not have the "Self -Leveling" feature, this may be a deal breaker for some users. The adjustable preload and lift capability is worth the price alone. You can get 2" or so of lift without the disadvantage of a bracket lift changing the shock angles. These should ride better than stock shocks on a top mount bracket lift, if you reduce the preload.
The packaging of the product is very good and they arrived in good condition. There are tools provided in the box to adjust the preload, these tools are basic, but they do work. The very wide range of adjustment will also allow an additional 2" of lift for those who do not want to use a bracket lift. The user will need to experiment with the preload setting on their particular machine to get the best results. The instructions for adjusting preload are not well covered in the instructions or the install video, so the user is pretty much on their own. For preload adjustment, You Tube is your friend. If you bolt them on as they come out of the box, you are going to automatically get the additional full 2" of lift. Since I was not wanting additional lift from these shocks, the "as Shipped" preload was way too high. I reduced the preload down about 3" inches to benefit from the softer suspension.
These shocks and springs appear hefty and the finish looks good. The shafts are large and hard chromed. Shock bodies larger than stock and are bright zinc plated steel. Springs are nicely powder coated black. Threaded adjustment collars are provided for preload adjustment. According to RC, the damping is accomplished using bending shim washer stacks, which is a premium feature. No adjustment for Compression or Rebound are provided, but none was expected at this price point. Both ends of the shocks feature OEM style bushings. All stock hardware is reused.
In summary, for $700, I consider them a good value, especially for those who cannot justify or maybe cannot afford $2k-$3k, or more for full blown "race" shocks. We ARE NOT aggressive or fast riders, this factor needs to be taken in to consideration by the user. A fast or aggressive rider will probably not benefit from this product. The stock Pioneer Suspension geometry is the ultimate limiting factor, shocks cannot change that fact. If you are like us and simply want a noticeably "better than stock" ride and possibly some additional lift, then these shocks might be for you. These are, at least a good substitute for the OEM shocks. The only thing that I have not determined was the long term durability of the product. They do have a 3 year warranty, so that should be some protection against problems, going forward. Time will tell. Feel free to PM me if you have other questions.
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Monte,
It was a pleasure to get to meet you and your group. Always enjoy meeting and interacting with folks one on one. Thanks for your kind complement on the build. Forums are great, but putting a face with a name is always best. Like the iconic HONDA Advertisement says "You Meet the Nicest People on a HONDA!" Looking forward to see you all again on the trails.
G
Just installed these on my machine. Everything he says is pretty spot on. I’m running them with C-Fab arms. My height numbers were different than his. With all preload taken out, my machine dropped an inch from the benchmarks I measured to with the stock shocks on. There was roughly .5” of thread from the bottom of the shock. As mentioned, they’re shipped with a ton of preload. There was 1.75” of thread from the top and this raised my machine nearly FOUR inches. That’s correct. 3 7/8ths to be exact. Also, as he mentioned, bottom the shocks out before on the machine. WD40 on the set but helps. I made a pin vise by just drilling holes in my work bench and putting #3 Phillips screwdrivers through the shock into the bench. I now have mine adjusted about 1.5” over the stock shocks. I rode her pretty good last Saturday. About 65 miles. Mud, sand, rock and water. I think they’re a bang for your buck shock. I’m not ready to drop $2,000 and then wait 16 weeks for shocks. Worth the $700 IMO.
I just ordered the same coil overs for my machine, 3 week wait here in Northern Canada. Thanks for the input.
Just a quick update on the M1 RC shocks. I added 1/2" of additional preload front and rear. Front is now 1" of total preload and Rear is now 1 1/4" total preload. This raised the machine about 1" over the previous setting. I am looking for the machine to sag a bit, once I ride it, but I am getting close to the right preload settings. My previous setting was too soft, so this was a planned change or adjustment.
I also talked to the folks at the Rough Country Booth at the Outdoor Expo in Hot Springs,Ar last weekend. The RC shocks have a 250lb/in front rate and a 275lb/in rear rate. They are supposed to be working on optional higher rate springs for these shocks. I may go heavier on the rear, that is if RC really does come out with a 300-350 lb/in spring.
While doing this task, I found a very loose Left rear wheel bearing and replaced that as well. I also found worn suspension bushings, so the next item is going to be replacing all the worn out bushings in the upper front control arms and the rear knuckles. I have parts on order for this project. All of these bushings on my machine have considerable or excessive wear. Seems crazy that the plastic bushings will wear out a hardened steel center collar, but that is exactly what happened. It looks to me like there was never any grease or other lubrication on these pivot points from the factory. Will update when this is done.
I also talked to the folks at the Rough Country Booth at the Outdoor Expo in Hot Springs,Ar last weekend. The RC shocks have a 250lb/in front rate and a 275lb/in rear rate. They are supposed to be working on optional higher rate springs for these shocks. I may go heavier on the rear, that is if RC really does come out with a 300-350 lb/in spring.
While doing this task, I found a very loose Left rear wheel bearing and replaced that as well. I also found worn suspension bushings, so the next item is going to be replacing all the worn out bushings in the upper front control arms and the rear knuckles. I have parts on order for this project. All of these bushings on my machine have considerable or excessive wear. Seems crazy that the plastic bushings will wear out a hardened steel center collar, but that is exactly what happened. It looks to me like there was never any grease or other lubrication on these pivot points from the factory. Will update when this is done.
Let us know what you think. I am pleased so far. I am also passing on information to RC with any comments, good or bad.
Just to repeat this point, in case someone might think I am somehow being compensated by RC for these positive comments, this is not the case. I bought these from their web store and paid full price. Just wanted to make this clear as there are many companies out there who are "buying" good reviews and positive product recommendations. If I had felt that I had made a mistake, or these shocks were crap, I would have stated that as well. Just wanted to assure people, my opinion cannot be "bought". I am looking forward to hearing other feedback as more of these shocks get out into the field.
Does anyone know if these shocks will fit a 100-5 Deluxe? Rough Country website says that they won't. I chatted with customer service online to verify and they said that they hadn't tested them on the Deluxe at this time. I thought the only differences from the factory were trim levels and wheel size.
They will fit. I have a set running on my 2016 1000-5D. The only issue that you will find is that you will lose the "Self-Leveling Rear Suspension" feature. These shocks DO NOT Self level. I am very satisfied with these on my machine. I do not require the Self-Leveling, this was not important to me. If "Self Leveling Suspension" is something you want to keep, then these are not for you.
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I’m still waiting! Rough country is having shipping issues. I called today and 2 more week wait. I’ve already waited 3 weeks 😤
I will definitely let you know what I think! I’ve made a pretty big order and I’m thinking they are waiting for it all to come in before they ship to me (independent distributor). A lot has changed since my Honda pioneer purchase in December
Upgrades so far are
- 16k BTU RC cab heater
- Seizmik doors
- Seizmik windshield
- Seizmik mirrors
- Chinese back window
- Kolpin gun rack
- installed overhead SSV sound system
- Installed overhead subwoofer
- Installed automotive weather strip in door jams
- Installed dual batteries
- installed synthetic rope
- insulated “fire wall” shifter areas
- installed sound deadening to seat and back panels
waiting for
- RC dual 10” LEDs
- RC 10” bumper panel LEDs
- RC storage compartment
- RC Coil over with 2” lift
- LED rocker switches
On the list to order
-30” tires
-Offset A arms
-Possible RC 3” lift kit and dial down the shocks depending on ride
- Rhino 2.0 axles
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