P500 p5 suspension

[JWB]

Wow, learned a valuable lesson on suspension yesterday! After mounting the spare I cranked the rear shocks one more notch which maxed them out. Occasionally you have those 'oh sh**' moments where you don't see it until you're in it, was following a P1k yesterday, @Remington , and pushed the little 5 pretty good to keep up. Got into a short wasted spot on the trail at speed, never saw it coming, rear end was violently bucking, wife was wearing the full harness and I was wearing the lap belt which held me down from bouncing off the roof. Took about three good hops and in the middle of it I felt like I had lost control. Taking that notch back out of the rear as bottoming out would have been better than that. It was ugly!

Glad y'all didn't get hurt! You can imagine how that would've went without the seat-belts... What you just described is what I endured for 3 solid days my first trip to H/M trails, chasing a bunch of maniacs on 800-1000cc ATV's, and why I'm so ate up with my suspension set up, and why I've been saying the stock shocks shouldn't even be allowed to be called 'shock absorbers'. I think they're just springs on hollow tubes. Sorry for the rant. If you're not seriously into 'tinkering' or rock-crawling type of riding, don't do air-suspension, get a set of the Walker Evans bolt-on shocks, and enjoy a completely different machine that won't try to kill you when you have a repeat of yesterday.

 

[JWB]

Yes you did! I didn't think you were going to follow me up that short cut and Take the curve lol. Rhonda took the P1K5 up that one time and got some mega air! Glad you guys made it ok! Made for some fun talks afterwards.

Love the signature line. Wish it wasn't true....

 

[JWB]

I finished installing the new air compressor and air tank today. I thought I would be able to get the tank under the seat.... no way! It's ginormous. I ended up putting it on the cargo rack in front of my box. Only had to move box back about 3". I made a small mount plate, and some slight mods to the power steering mount, and was able to mount the new compressor behind the radiator, soooo Choog- we need to talk about that box! Of course I forgot to take pictures, but I'll post some tomorrow. The new compressor is incredibly quiet- I can't hear it over the engine at anything over idle. That was a pleasant surprise, cuz the tiny compressor I just took out, sounded like an airplane under the hood. And of course, with 2.5 gallons of 200psi air, the suspension adjusts, and/or recovers very quickly after dropping one side for a cross-hill maneuver, or after dropping the front end for a really steep climb, and will now put all four corners up on it's 'tippy-toes' for maximum ground clearance- without waiting. All in all, a very nice refinement to the system.

Here's some pics of the new set-up, the pic with small tank and comp. is how it was.

 

[Remington]

Love the signature line. Wish it wasn't true....

You mean my cocked Locked signature?

 

[JWB]

You mean my cocked Locked signature?

Ha Ha. NO!
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

So true. So sad.

 

[trigger]

Glad y'all didn't get hurt! You can imagine how that would've went without the seat-belts... What you just described is what I endured for 3 solid days my first trip to H/M trails, chasing a bunch of maniacs on 800-1000cc ATV's, and why I'm so ate up with my suspension set up, and why I've been saying the stock shocks shouldn't even be allowed to be called 'shock absorbers'. I think they're just springs on hollow tubes. Sorry for the rant. If you're not seriously into 'tinkering' or rock-crawling type of riding, don't do air-suspension, get a set of the Walker Evans bolt-on shocks, and enjoy a completely different machine that won't try to kill you when you have a repeat of yesterday.

Thanks JWB, yeah the WE fronts may be in my future.

 

[Remington]

Ha Ha. NO!
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants"

So true. So sad.

Your exactly right.. I'm a true constitutionalist. I believe in what this country was founded on. That's one of my favorite quotes. I can't see that on here when I post, I completely forgot I put it on here lol

 

[JWB]

I gotta share this- I was out 'testing' the new mods today, and wanted to try out the doubler I made for my winch. So I found a downed tree and drove up on to it, and very nicely completely 'bridged' the machine- all four wheels just tickling the ground. Got out, made sure there were no snakes, pulled some cable off the winch, installed the doubler, pulled it to the nearest solid anchor, made my connection, and winched er over the tree- no prob! Unhooked everything, winched the cable back in, and had to make a 3-point turn. Sat there looking for my best path out, and realized I was completely surrounded by bees. LOTS of bees, and I'm allergic. So, without panicking (on the outside anyways cuz I was screaming like a little girl on the inside) I very calmly got out, and very slowly walked a ways away. Did not get stung! So there I am, out in the woods, in a ravine, by myself, and by the grace of GOD not stung, my P500 is 30 feet away still idling, completely surrounded by bees. Awesome moment. When I made my 3-point turn, I drove up onto some old cuts of wood, and totally rooted up a bees nest. So being the freakin genius that I am, I waited about 10 minutes, and the bees seemed to be calming down, so i got a long (LONG) branch, reached through the open door and pushed the throttle, aaaaaand? it's in neutral - F**K! and the engine revving up P.O.'d the bees again..... wait, wait, wait, and slowly get in front of machine, push shifter with stick, wait, wait, wait, sneak back around, push throttle with stick- gently this time, and got the machine about 20ft from the nest. After another 10 minutes, I was able to get back in the machine and drive out- fortunately, there were no snakes, because I completely forgot about those with all the damn bees flying around, and my "checking for snakes" involves alot of stomping and noise, and I practically walked over top of that bees nest several times when I was hooking and unhooking the cable- go figure......

 

[JWB]

Here's a link to a video of the air suspension in action after installing the higher pressure air compressor and tank. I did have the rear air pressure too high, but it still shows the articulation pretty well.

 

[trigger]

Here's a link to a video of the air suspension in action after installing the higher pressure air compressor and tank. I did have the rear air pressure too high, but it still shows the articulation pretty well. JWB Air suspension articualation .mp4

Wow, that's pretty good for a 5! Tires stayed in contact and that's what we're going for. If it wasn't for having to add all those lines and sh** I'd consider going that route. You should do another one showing the back, feels like it has less articulation in the rear even with the sway bar off?

 

[JWB]

Wow, that's pretty good for a 5! Tires stayed in contact and that's what we're going for. If it wasn't for having to add all those lines and sh** I'd consider going that route. You should do another one showing the back, feels like it has less articulation in the rear even with the sway bar off?

That's as good as a P5 can be in that type of terrain. That is the full extent of available control arm travel without binding the CV joints. We did one vid from the back, but I switched it to rear 'articulate' mode, so the rear does exactly what the front does, but full articulation in the rear is not as effective as the front, due to the major traction problem we have on the front. (EDIT: This problem is now solved with Torq-Masters TORQ-Locker.) I had the pressure too high in the vid, because with the new compressor and air tank, the damn thing reacts so quick now. So the articulation can be enhanced to all four corners when the pressure is right. I really need to test drive a machine with coilovers so I can see what the ride- particularly high speed-is like compared to the air system, because that's the only area where coilovers could possibly be better. That being said, I do realize that the cheap air shocks I'm using will never match a high quality shock- like the Walker-Evans for durability and continuous high speed control, but on the other hand, I have run my machine for 6hrs, non-stop, virtually flat-out on the 'Rock-house' and 'Buffalo Mountain' trails on the Hatfield-McCoy trail system with no fade or any noticeable deterioration in performance. (The machine's performance, not mine- I was toast) I'll post that vid of the rears tomorrow night when I get home.

 

[JWB]

Here's the link to the vid of the rears, and when I came back towards the camera, I switched back to front articulation, and then dropped the air pressure on the 'high side' to level out out the machine, and then aired em back up as I came out of the trench- too much air. It did the stock suspension thing coming out of that trench- a good reminder of how good the stock 'suspension' was- not

 

[Chooglin]

Here's the link to the vid of the rears, and when I came back towards the camera, I switched back to front articulation, and then dropped the air pressure on the 'high side' to level out out the machine, and then aired em back up as I came out of the trench- too much air. It did the stock suspension thing coming out of that trench- a good reminder of how good the stock 'suspension' was- not.
Rear articulation and lean compensation

Link not working

 

[JWB]

Link not working
View attachment 54161

Try the link in the original post now- I deleted and re-attached the link

 

[Chooglin]

It's working now , that is pretty darn slick. Are you making air adjustments on the fly (as your driving)?

 

[JWB]

It's working now , that is pretty darn slick. Are you making air adjustments on the fly (as your driving)?

Thanks! Yes I was adjusting while driving, but it's so easy to put too much pressure in the shocks- as you saw in the vid. I put 50-60 miles on it this weekend on varied terrain, from crawling to flat-out runs on hay fields, so I'm getting better at modulating the pressures on the fly as I go from one type of terrain and/or speed or load to another. Being able to modulate each wheel independently in 'rock crawling' types of terrain is the coolest thing ever... for me anyways! We did some more vids of some terrain crawling down into and out of, steep banked creek beds too this weekend. Those vids are still on the Princesses phone, and I'm going to spend four days at H/M trails this week, so I won't be able to post those till next week.

 

[JWB]

Once the auto-locker is installed, my machine will be as maxed-out as a P500 can be with stock A-arms, at least in relation to traction. Short of completely re-engineering the suspension system, the only way to improve would be terrain specific tires.

 

[bikeman]

to anyone out there wanting to do the air suspension i have 8 of the gabriel shocks used for the mod i took them off and have since sold the pioneer 500 and and bought a cf moto 800 which is more suited to my type of riding give me a call cell 435 757 2050 i live in northern utah the shocks have aproximately 300 miles on them. i will sell them for half the cost of new see attached picture.

 

[JWB]

to anyone out there wanting to do the air suspension i have 8 of the gabriel shocks used for the mod i took them off and have since sold the pioneer 500 and and bought a cf moto 800 which is more suited to my type of riding give me a call cell 435 757 2050 i live in northern utah the shocks have aproximately 300 miles on them. i will sell them for half the cost of new see attached picture.

View attachment 54366

Sorry the Honda didn't work out for you. Love to hear how the new machine does over time.

 

[pFive]

Thanks for the videos JWB, it looks like you have it set up really well!