P1000 The I-4WD System

[AggieVet]

I know that a lot of people are against the new I-4WD system that will be on the 2017 LE, but surely there is a positive side to it. I don't believe that Honda would spend the $$$ for R&D to develop a new system if it was going to make the vehicle worse. I understand that it would be worse in nasty mud, but what about other conditions?

Can anybody give me the advantages for this system over locking diffs? I am wanting to buy a P1k5 in the very near future, and I had been holding out until Honda released the 2017 specs.

 

[CumminsPusher]

Honestly the only advantage I see is not having to move the selector to the diff lock position. It will have more traction in 4wd mode because the tire that has more traction will get power as opposed to the current setup that gives more power to the one that slips. It's one less solenoid in the 4wd setup so it's one less to fail but I'm sure it uses clutches in the diff to control that.
In diff mode that all changes however.4 lock is 4 lock. I'm sure Honda did this to gain market shares but once one is out hopefully someone can give us feedback on how well the system actually works, I don't see it as positive but I hope I'm wrong.

 

[Tflynn]

Hmm you pose an interesting question. First off let's remember that at this point nobody knows how the i4wd will perform because nobody's driven or tested it. But, I think that we all (myself included) assume it is basically an All Wheel Drive system like what we've seen offered on automobiles for awhile (think Subaru). So assuming that's what it is, I feel that the greatest advantage of an AWD system is realized in the snow. I remember reading about a jeep club that rode snow regularly and they actually preferred limited slip diffs over lockers. I believe the reasoning was having all tires breaking traction at the same time would cause their rigs to slide sideways, sometimes off the trail, quite often in those conditions.

Don't forget, rally cars love AWD!

Depending on your intended use, i4wd has it's place I'm sure. My biggest problem with it is I DON'T want a machine that "thinks" for me. I'm driving so I want to drive! Not to mention if this system breaks I sure can't fix it, don't like that.

 

[JTW]

Hmm you pose an interesting question. First off let's remember that at this point nobody knows how the i4wd will perform because nobody's driven or tested it. But, I think that we all (myself included) assume it is basically an All Wheel Drive system like what we've seen offered on automobiles for awhile (think Subaru). So assuming that's what it is, I feel that the greatest advantage of an AWD system is realized in the snow. I remember reading about a jeep club that rode snow regularly and they actually preferred limited slip diffs over lockers. I believe the reasoning was having all tires breaking traction at the same time would cause their rigs to slide sideways, sometimes off the trail, quite often in those conditions.

Don't forget, rally cars love AWD!

Depending on your intended use, i4wd has it's place I'm sure. My biggest problem with it is I DON'T want a machine that "thinks" for me. I'm driving so I want to drive! Not to mention if this system breaks I sure can't fix it, don't like that.

Well put!

 

[AggieVet]

So, the rear diff won't be locked? Isn't there still a "Turf Mode"? That wouldn't be needed if the rear wasn't always locked, am I correct?

 

[CumminsPusher]

Rear end sounds to be the exact same.


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[sharp]

I know that a lot of people are against the new I-4WD system that will be on the 2017 LE, but surely there is a positive side to it. I don't believe that Honda would spend the $$$ for R&D to develop a new system if it was going to make the vehicle worse. I understand that it would be worse in nasty mud, but what about other conditions?

Can anybody give me the advantages for this system over locking diffs? I am wanting to buy a P1k5 in the very near future, and I had been holding out until Honda released the 2017 specs.

I do a lot of trail riding, so having the diff lock is awsome because I'm in control of it. However people that buy these just to trail ride is in the minority Most people that buy these use them for work and hunting so the i4wd was probably a good move for them over all, only time will tell.

 

[CumminsPusher]

Like Sharp says here too. Personally I try not to have to use diff other then climbing rocks. It's nice backup to have when you're about to get stuck.

 

[AggieVet]

So it seems that this new system will be worse for trail riding? I will be doing some trail riding (not the primary purpose) when I do get one. Again, I know that nobody has actually driven one yet.

 

[sharp]

So it seems that this new system will be worse for trail riding? I will be doing some trail riding (not the primary purpose) when I do get one. Again, I know that nobody has actually driven one yet.

Not necessarily worse, but it gives you another option while on the trail. Climbing rocks, diff lock is great, because when it's locked in, it's locked in and you know it. It will grab climb almost anything.

 

[CumminsPusher]

So it seems that this new system will be worse for trail riding? I will be doing some trail riding (not the primary purpose) when I do get one. Again, I know that nobody has actually driven one yet.

We'll have to all wait a bit to know for sure. We're all guessing a bit here. For road applications awd is probably better but for off road I sure don't see it. One positive is easier steering because you're not fighting the locked nose but the power steering does a pretty good job of that. It'll definitely go through brakes a little more in my eyes because it's using them to control wheel spin. Again most of us aren't talking hauling ass down a snowy road which is where rally cars shine we're talking trails,rock climbs headed out by yourself to go get game. I still think it'll be better then the sloppy Polaris system but not as positive a feel as current but I may eat my words here.
We just need someone to test it all out.


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[1BadDart]

I see the new system as something between what we have now, 4wd and 4wd lock. For general trail riding it'll probably be better, just drive and not worry about stopping and changing modes. For the nasty stuff where a person needs the 4wd lock probably not as good, but who knows. Until someone actually put's one on the trail all we have is speculation and opinions based off what little information Honda has released.

 

[mbjeepxj]

From Honda's website:

Using proven, advanced technology from Honda’s automotive division, you get the benefits associated with a locked front differential with none of the downsides. That means it maintains front-wheel traction even if one wheel wants to spin on ice or mud or if it’s in a hole. But at the same time, you get the lighter steering, better tracking at high speeds, tighter turning radius, and reduced kickback associated with unlocked front differentials.

Clearly only the front wheels will have the brake traction control feature. No mention in the description of all 4 corners having it.

Jeep has had brake traction control for almost a decade in the Wrangler starting with the 2007 JK.
They call it BLD or Brake Lock Differentials.
It works well on our 2009 JKU. I enhanced it further by adding a Detroit TruTrac Limited Slip to the rear end of ours. The TruTrac is a torsen style limited slip that's all gears and no clutches to wear out. With the combination of limited slip and BLD, our Jeep acts like it's got a automatic locker in the rear end, but much smoother.

It is true that your brakes will wear faster... that's a given.

Still not sure of my opinion on the tech being introduced in a SxS. I've only been on one "real" trail riding trip in my P1K when I went with friends down to Nebo, IL. We did all of the hard stuff and I never locked in the front at all. Just stayed in 4WD all day. Seems like the i4WD option would be a little extra traction when needed without having to shift. But, at the same time I think it might be something else that can go wrong... one more potential point of failure.

 

[CumminsPusher]

The stopping and changing modes is just to help protect the manufacture and the vehicle. It guards against driver error. As long as the wheels aren't spinning separately it is safe to switch if necessary.


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[mbjeepxj]

The stopping and changing modes is just to help protect the manufacture and the vehicle. It guards against driver error. As long as the wheels aren't spinning separately it is safe to switch if necessary.

I agree, but the likely scenario is that one would be stuck and then necessitate a mode switch between 4WD and 4WD-Lock. In that case the stopping part is moot. Just have to make sure you're not spinning a tire while you shift.

I also have to agree with first hand experience on side-hilling on slick trails with full lockers. An old Cherokee I had with regular Detroit lockers front and rear would be a b**** on slick or snowy off-camber trails. With no way to unlock those lockers was especially unnerving.

 

[CumminsPusher]

I agree, but the likely scenario is that one would be stuck and then necessitate a mode switch between 4WD and 4WD-Lock. In that case the stopping part is moot. Just have to make sure you're not spinning a tire while you shift.

I also have to agree with first hand experience on side-hilling on slick trails with full lockers. An old Cherokee I had with regular Detroit lockers front and rear would be a b**** on slick or snowy off-camber trails. With no way to unlock those lockers was especially unnerving.

Yes I cannot stress enough on shifting ONLY if wheels aren't spinning! Let's hope Honda retains both setups and it's not a transition period for us unless they really have it down well.

 

[AggieVet]

Thanks for the responses guys! I guess it's going to be a wait and see and potentially bight the bullet and buy one. It will be interesting to see what people think of it. I have been trail riding in our family's 700-4 and I rarely use the front diff lock, and it goes through some pretty rocky hill climbs. I hope that this system will be an improvement, and not a disaster.

 

[Hondasxs]

I just skimmed through this real quick. so I may have missed a few things.
Trust me, Honda has done their research on this. They have published a good handful if not a dozen patents related to this setup. Honda claims its the NEW STANDARD and I do believe them. I think it is going to be something like we have never seen. I'll try to post some more of the patents soon.

Trail riding, mud riding, any riding. Put it in I-4WD and you don't have to worry about it. It will lock the limited slip when needed and disengage it when it does not. Remember the old days riding your Rancher, you would get stuck and pull the front breaks and both wheels would spin. That's what this is going to do without you even knowing. Traction when you need it and ease of control when you don't.

It is also able to control which wheel gets the most break when stopping. For example, when loaded the rear wheels will get the most break power while the fronts only require light power. This will be a great feature for northern areas where snow and ice are common.

Its NOT ABS.
Some have labeled it as ABS!!! NO, its Traction control for your Pioneer! There is a difference. Nothing I have read has suggested a ABS type system.

Like @CumminsPusher said, No one has even tested it yet. But I expect that to change soon as Honda is going to what to show it off. I would be looking for media demo days by Jan.

 

[Manwell]

It looks interesting to me for sure, although I'm not in the market for a new machine at this moment. As was mentioned earlier, I too like to think for myself but computers and related programmin can be amazing! Time holds the answers...

 

[Plumber32]

I wonder how it will work if really have to give it. will it limit the rpms? like the traction control in my truck ?