P1000 Wheel bonnet woes!!

[lee]

saw two good youtubes on trailers this morning.

The first one by TFL truck is more 'this is how they test trailers to validate the tow rating'.
The second by Engineering explained is more the logic behind what they are doing.
They where filmed together and show a pretty complete story.
I'm waiting for the next one in the series that explains how a single axle trailer is just as good as a two axle trailer.

 

[Admin]

 

[JTW]

 

[JACKAL]

I'm waiting for the next one in the series that explains how a single axle trailer is just as good as a two axle trailer.

 

[BigOL3]

I would like to see a comparison of the big 3 on this type of testing.

 

[lee]

I think the point is they all do this, even Honda, Toyota and hyndi.
And for the trailer they claim it can tow they pass the same spec.

Now, how much margin they have passing the spec might be interesting.
But that is why we have TFL Truck. Ike gauntlet testing.

If I where to place a bet, the desert tow test is probably the limiting factor, followed by the tow vehicle brakes only test.

 

[JTW]

I think the point is they all do this, even Honda, Toyota and hyndi.
And for the trailer they claim it can tow they pass the same spec.

Now, how much margin they have passing the spec might be interesting.
But that is why we have TFL Truck. Ike gauntlet testing.

If I where to place a bet, the desert tow test is probably the limiting factor, followed by the tow vehicle brakes only test.

Yup.. a world where everybody gets a blue ribbon

 

[JACKAL]

Here is the SAE J2807 testing parameter bullet points, the actual specification is 27 pages long.

Here are some highlights.

• SAE J2807 includes all vehicles up to 14,000 pounds GVWR.
• The tow test procedures designed by the big brains at the SAE consist of a series of rigorous real-world challenges to determine the Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR) of a vehicle and trailer combination.
• The rules require that a tow vehicle “shall be equipped with the propulsion system or powertrain and driveline (engine, transmission, axle ratio, tire size, etc.) and cooling package to produce the GCWR under test.”
• The SAE J2807 document defines procedures and requirements to determine Gross Combination Weight Rating (GCWR) and calculate corresponding Trailer Weight Rating (TWR) for any tow vehicle.
• In addition to a vehicle’s base curb weight, the “Tow Vehicle Total Weight” (TVTW) for testing tow vehicles allocates 150 pounds for the driver, 150 pounds for a front seat passenger, the weight of all tow package equipment, and spicified weight of optional equipment (hitch ball, weight distribution bars, fifth wheel hitch, and such) split evenly between the front and rear axles.

The SAE J2807 test procedures are designed to level the playing field in trailer tow ratings for all vehicles model year 2013 or later.
The test procedures include the following:

 

[lee]

Yup.. a world where everybody gets a blue ribbon

Where it starts to get funky is the TV ads like the Ford e-up towing 1 million pounds or Toyota towing the space shuttle (300k lb).

With 2807 the playing field is leveler.
When a mini van is rated at 3800 lb and a 1 ton dulley is rated at 30k lb they are both capable at that weight.
In the old days a manufacturer did some test they concocted to say the tow rating was whatever.
To win the tow rating war all they had to do was change the test requierments.
Now, the test is fixed, if they want to say the rating is more they have to change the equipment to meet the test.
Like the new Ram having a 1 meter wide radiator.
Ram set the cooling spec then told the styling guys they had to fit it in.
Front end is ugly as s*** but the thing has a ton of cooling capacity. (Actualy 15 tons worth).

 

[JACKAL]

Where it starts to get funky is the TV ads like the Ford e-up towing 1 million pounds or Toyota towing the space shuttle (300k lb).

With 2807 the playing field is leveler.
When a mini van is rated at 3800 lb and a 1 ton dulley is rated at 30k lb they are both capable at that weight.
In the old days a manufacturer did some test they concocted to say the tow rating was whatever.
To win the tow rating war all they had to do was change the test requierments.
Now, the test is fixed, if they want to say the rating is more they have to change the equipment to meet the test.
Like the new Ram having a 1 meter wide radiator.
Ram set the cooling spec then told the styling guys they had to fit it in.
Front end is ugly as s*** but the thing has a ton of cooling capacity. (Actualy 15 tons worth).

Yeah, Ford was famous (read notorious) for changing towing specs just to out do RAM on paper without actually changing anything on the vehicle (before SAE J2807) now they don't get to make up parameters.

That being said the Ford 2015 / 2016 SD had considerable cooling headroom compared to my 2017. My 2015 F450 even had an additional transmission cooler the 2017-19 models do not. (They are adding it back for 2020) Watching my gauges while towing you can see the difference in temperatures of transmission fluid and engine oil temps. I have never had them signal hot but I appreciated the 15-20 degree cooler running temps under load up long grades.

 

[JimmyA]

I would like to see a comparison of the big 3 on this type of testing.

Why? They already chose the Best of the 3 towing trucks in that class!

 

[BigOL3]

Why? They already chose the Best of the 3 towing trucks in that class!

WHY??? Well I saw what the 3500 Ram did in the test, but not the Ferd of GM ...... that is why.