Installing second battery

[Talonman]

More questions about installing a second battery on a Honda Talon. First of all thanks to all who shared their experience on how they installed a second battery. I created a wiring diagram based off my needs with experiences shared from club site members, YouTube videos and direct feedback from Honda SXS team. With this said and having formalized a diagram for installation, I’m asking the club to share feedback on potential problems with wiring diagram or other suggestions of improvement. Your help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!

(Deleted old image.)

 

[Admin]

 

[Hondasxs]

Didnt see this one..

UPDATE..
Dual volt, The upper one needs to go to the small red post with key-on power.

 

[Hondasxs]

few more changes.

 

[Hondasxs]

 

[Hondasxs]

Sorry I didn't get back to you if you emailed this copy to me for review.

 

[Brmcg324]

I agree with this markup; to not have that wire from the incoming main battery to the stinger relay, that would draw power from the primary battery, what we do not want. I am considering this circuit for my pioneer 500. I am an electrical engineer with 40+ years of seeing every possible kind of electrical failure. It would not hurt to have a circuit breaker in the wire coming from the secondary battery, not sure what rating it needs, just protecting from a massive overload (as in a pinched wire against metal). One more comment is that the stinger relay coil wire is coming from the main battery. The stinger relay will not energize if the main battery volts are little low. I am not sure I want that. The purpose of the stinger relay is to not energize if the incoming coil voltage is low. Sorry for all the tech talk. I would like to know the part numbers of the isolator and stinger relay you have or are considering.

 

[Brmcg324]

Did you decide on a battery? There are quite a few good comments and ideas across the forum about auxiliary batteries. Seems like the best results are when the second battery is a close match or identical to the original / main battery. My 2020 pioneer 500 came with a Yuasa GYZ16H AGM battery (AGM = absorbed glass mat). In researching, it would seem Honda’s voltage regulator has the perfect charging voltage for this battery. People who use old style battery chargers (too high volts or too much current) can kill these batteries or shorten the battery life. Unfortunately they cannot be fast charged without hurting them.
My main concern is snow plowing at night and using the winch a lot to raise the plow. My light bar gets pretty dim when the winch kicks in. It’s not much weight for the winch to lift the plow, but it’s clearly a high draw with both the lights and the winch both running at the same time. Trying to avoid that moment at night when you cannot start the engine out in the dark in the snow! I live in Ohio, so not that much snow, just that I am a 60-something person who hates shoveling snow. Its much more fun to plow the snow and a great excuse to ride around on the pioneer.

 

[Talonman]

Thanks guys for quick reply, greatly appreciated! Attached is a revised drawing based on feedback. Drawing also includes component names and part numbers. I was planning to run 4 gauge wire between batteries and electrical components to support a 100 amp system. The battery is a good point to bring up. I had looked at many options, but decided to purchase OEM battery to match existing battery. My goal was to use good quality components that would best match up to what Honda may have designed for aux. battery setup. Again thank you for great advice!

 

[GROR]

Just a little feedback, if you wire the winch off the stinger relay the winch will not operate with out the key switch turned on. I believe in your schematic the winch will operate anytime.

 

[Hondasxs]

Just a little feedback, if you wire the winch off the stinger relay the winch will not operate with out the key switch turned on. I believe in your schematic the winch will operate anytime.

Yes. But not advised.
The Stinger is not rated for a the winch load as it is 200+ amps under rated.
All (most) winches have a "key-on" wire. Which is not shown in this diagram.
*winch in/out switch (not shown)

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[GROR]

Stinger SGP32 200 AMP Battery Relay Isolator and Relay​

 

[Hondasxs]

Stinger SGP32 200 AMP Battery Relay Isolator and Relay​

Still under rated for full winch load.

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[GROR]

Stinger SGP35 500-AMP Relay and Isolator , Black​

Sorry your absolutely right.. I stand corrected...the winch is on the key switch so I wouldn't use a relay and go directly to the battery.

 

[Hondasxs]

I see the one you posted does have a 500a peak. 200 constant WL.
So it might be OK. For short full load pulls.

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[Brmcg324]

The winch fwd/rev direction switch wiring instructions should show its +12v wire connected to a key-on voltage source, the Honda accessory harness.

I am considering this same circuit. When the engine is running and alternator voltage above 12v, the True isolator is a relay that picks up and connects both batteries together in parallel. Both batteries are charging at the same time. If the draw on current, the total electrical load (winch and anything turned on at any moment) exceeds what the engine/alternator can provide, the electrical system dc volts will pull down to or below the battery volts (12v plus) at which time the two batteries and alternator are working together to provide the demanded current in amps. If the load and current draw is so much that the electrical system volts drops below the True isolator trip point, that relay will open and separate the two batteries.

Anything wired to the aux battery will only get power from the aux battery and risk running it out of charge. The aux battery voltmeter would now be much lower than the primary battery voltmeter.

When the load (winch) is shut off, the electrical system will jump back up to above 12v to the alternator voltage, True isolator relay will energize and connect the batteries in parallel again and both batteries will resume charging.

Also if the engine is switched off, the True isolator opens the relay and the aux battery is disconnected (the 12v “hot” positive terminal) from the main battery. So, whatever equipment connected to the aux battery cannot draw power from the main battery.

This is where the Stinger relay does it’s job. If the ignition key 12v is off, the stinger relay cuts power to the Blue Sea or whatever brand fuse box is there. In this example diagram, nothing can get power if the key is off. If there is something like an audio system or lights you want to be able run with the key off, it would need to be wired on the “hot“ side of the stinger relay, which is directly to the aux battery positive terminal. Even if the aux battery is drained down, it cannot take power from the main battery, which keeps the main battery ready to start the engine.

This is my reading of the electrical diagram. Like to hear if somebody has tested a circuit like this to see it working. I think it’s very important to have the two voltmeters and be able to see the True isolator indicator light. It would be easy to wire this a little wrong and not get the full benefit of the protection. Sorry for writing this book in my forum post!

 

[PaulF]

The winch fwd/rev direction switch wiring instructions should show its +12v wire connected to a key-on voltage source, the Honda accessory harness.

I am considering this same circuit. When the engine is running and alternator voltage above 12v, the True isolator is a relay that picks up and connects both batteries together in parallel. Both batteries are charging at the same time. If the draw on current, the total electrical load (winch and anything turned on at any moment) exceeds what the engine/alternator can provide, the electrical system dc volts will pull down to or below the battery volts (12v plus) at which time the two batteries and alternator are working together to provide the demanded current in amps. If the load and current draw is so much that the electrical system volts drops below the True isolator trip point, that relay will open and separate the two batteries.

Anything wired to the aux battery will only get power from the aux battery and risk running it out of charge. The aux battery voltmeter would now be much lower than the primary battery voltmeter.

When the load (winch) is shut off, the electrical system will jump back up to above 12v to the alternator voltage, True isolator relay will energize and connect the batteries in parallel again and both batteries will resume charging.

Also if the engine is switched off, the True isolator opens the relay and the aux battery is disconnected (the 12v “hot” positive terminal) from the main battery. So, whatever equipment connected to the aux battery cannot draw power from the main battery.

This is where the Stinger relay does it’s job. If the ignition key 12v is off, the stinger relay cuts power to the Blue Sea or whatever brand fuse box is there. In this example diagram, nothing can get power if the key is off. If there is something like an audio system or lights you want to be able run with the key off, it would need to be wired on the “hot“ side of the stinger relay, which is directly to the aux battery positive terminal. Even if the aux battery is drained down, it cannot take power from the main battery, which keeps the main battery ready to start the engine.

This is my reading of the electrical diagram. Like to hear if somebody has tested a circuit like this to see it working. I think it’s very important to have the two voltmeters and be able to see the True isolator indicator light. It would be easy to wire this a little wrong and not get the full benefit of the protection. Sorry for writing this book in my forum post!

I have a VERY close version of this setup and you are mostly correct.

1. The True isolator trigger voltage is not 12V. The cut-in (when it starts charging the aux battery) is 13.4V (to make sure the main battery is well charged first) and the cut-out (when it stops charging the aux battery) is 12.9V (to make sure the main battery does not get overly discharged). Both the cut-in and cut-out have a 10 second delay.
2. The isolator remains engaged as long as the the voltage is above the cut-in threshold and remains above the cut-out threshold, regardless if the key is on or not. Depending on how charged the batteries are, my blue light has stayed on for hours before the battery settles down below 12.9V and it goes off.

You can (with a diode to prevent feedback) use a bypass to engage the stinger without turning on the ignition. I went one step further and built a 15 minute "Retained Accessory Power" (like in a car) so my stinger is engaged for 15 minutes after the ignition is turned off. I wanted my comms to stay on after the ignition was turned off but also didn't want to accidently leave everything on and drain the aux battery. I also have a switch to trigger the stinger on/off without the ignition key.

Not that I use my winch very much but I have pulled out a couple machines and a Jeep, jump started 3 machines (off the aux battery) have and run my Comms, light bars, pods, whips for a while (maybe an hour at most), it has never failed to start or recharge the aux battery.

I did have a double volt meter at one time but is was a cheap piece of crap and caused interference with my Comms so I removed it and now just use a single meter on the aux battery side. If it shows over 13V, I know that both batteries are charging so that is all I feel I need.

 

[Hondasxs]

Correct. Goal is to have a fully independent accessory system outside the primary battery.

You may also be interested in a post i made that shows how to further control the isolator allowing it to disconnect from the primary even when at a overcharged state upon key-off. Thus killing the "blue light" when key is off.

Downside is a battery tender would not simultaneously charge the batteries.

Link -- TRUEAM Isolator Alternate KEY-ON ONLY wiring method!

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[Talonman]

Great feedback! All leads to greater confidence in what I have done with your help. So far my duel volt meter is working knowing potential of failure -Good insight. Aux battery fired up as redesigned by club members, working well. More planned electrical components to be added keeping within amp limits. Thanks again all, advice and help greatly appreciate!