P1000 True am isolator and relay wiring Trouble shooting

[gkozak]

I installed the complete kit with relay a few years back and worked as it should. Recently my dual mic tuning voltmeter stopped working. Thinking it must have fried I put a new one in, no life to it either. So I thought maybe the relay, replaced it no life. I believe there is power to the relay on ignition (was all set up proper years ago), but if there is and relay is ok then dual voltmeter should have life. I know my primary battery is done and needs to be replaced but how this would have anything to do with my lifeless looking dual voltmeter is beyond me. Could it be the actual true isolator causing the dual voltmeter to be non working ? I am at a loss to why the voltage just stopped. Ideas? What should I try ?

 

[Remington]

I know my primary battery is done and needs to be replaced

BINGO!
Id play like my service manager says when a question is aked like this when your jumping all over before taking care of a main possible known issue…..
Replace it then came back and ask questions.
Then he slams the phone down in your face🤣

Sorry for being so gruff. But we hear this alot.

 

[NewHere2]

Are the volt meters hooked to the Tru isolator ?

 

[CID]

I installed the complete kit with relay a few years back and worked as it should. Recently my dual mic tuning voltmeter stopped working. Thinking it must have fried I put a new one in, no life to it either. So I thought maybe the relay, replaced it no life. I believe there is power to the relay on ignition (was all set up proper years ago), but if there is and relay is ok then dual voltmeter should have life. I know my primary battery is done and needs to be replaced but how this would have anything to do with my lifeless looking dual voltmeter is beyond me. Could it be the actual true isolator causing the dual voltmeter to be non working ? I am at a loss to why the voltage just stopped. Ideas? What should I try ?

The dual VM doesn't care about anything other than the two leads to each battery and the ground supplied through the relay. If your primary battery is hosed, the VM will tell you.

Simple way to test the relay - take the ground lead off the relay and ground it, the VM should light up - if it does, the relay or its wiring is bad.

 

[bumperm]

Do you have a separate handheld voltmeter? If not, buy one, even a cheap one on-line or at Harbor Freight will do the job. Measure the voltage directly at each battery. At rest and with no load, a fully charged voltage is about 12.8 volts, while 12.3 is about half charged.

Your dual voltmeter, that comes with the Tru isolator/charger, uses positive voltage applied to each of its positive terminals, one for each battery. It is typically wired with a relay switched ground to turn on the meter display. The switched ground comes from a small relay that is ignition energized. When you turn on the key, 12 volts is applied to that relay, which closes its contacts and applies a ground to the dual voltage meter. A very simple circuit.

But to troubleshoot it, get the right tools and buy that digital volt/ohm meter.

 

[gkozak]

Are the volt meters hooked to the Tru isolator ?

It’s been hooked up like this for years, working until now. Although I replaced the relay, I have to verify if ignition power is getting to it because the dual voltmeter has no life.

 

[gkozak]

Do you have a separate handheld voltmeter? If not, buy one, even a cheap one on-line or at Harbor Freight will do the job. Measure the voltage directly at each battery. At rest and with no load, a fully charged voltage is about 12.8 volts, while 12.3 is about half charged.

Your dual voltmeter, that comes with the Tru isolator/charger, uses positive voltage applied to each of its positive terminals, one for each battery. It is typically wired with a relay switched ground to turn on the meter display. The switched ground comes from a small relay that is ignition energized. When you turn on the key, 12 volts is applied to that relay, which closes its contacts and applies a ground to the dual voltage meter. A very simple circuit.

But to troubleshoot it, get the right tools and buy that digital volt/ohm meter.

Yes, I read about this to test the actual isolator and will be doing this as well. I had been curious if anyone had known if a bad isolator had anything to do with a dual voltmeter going off.

 

[gkozak]

The dual VM doesn't care about anything other than the two leads to each battery and the ground supplied through the relay. If your primary battery is hosed, the VM will tell you.

Simple way to test the relay - take the ground lead off the relay and ground it, the VM should light up - if it does, the relay or its wiring is bad.

I agree with you that the dual VM should still work even with primary battery on last legs. I will test the relay, it was a cheap fix to replace it which did nothing, but will check test it, when you say wiring is bad (was wired correctly and working for two years), do you mean problem with the ignition wire, as that’s kind of where I am headed with it now.

 

[gkozak]

BINGO!
Id play like my service manager says when a question is aked like this when your jumping all over before taking care of a main possible known issue…..
Replace it then came back and ask questions.
Then he slams the phone down in your face🤣

Sorry for being so gruff. But we hear this alot.

Really ?? If you believe that a primary battery that is weak but needs replacement is the reason that a dual VM isn’t lighting up then you definitely need a new service manager. Has Jack all to do with the problem, if you can’t be constructive kiss off.

 

[Vikes79]

I’ve seen batts that are so bad that they won’t show any voltage at all.

It depends on which side of the circuit is powering the VM. If the VM is being powered by the bad battery then yes it is possible that it’s not going to power on especially if the isolator isn’t pushing amps to it.

 

[DRZRon1]

My advice is to mark the voltages you read down on that schematic, share and go from there - no guessing at it - lol.

Basically the voltmeter should diagnose where the circuit is bad - make sure you have a good ground on the voltmeter negative or best yet right to the battery post.

We will solve this.

 

[Remington]

Really ?? If you believe that a primary battery that is weak but needs replacement is the reason that a dual VM isn’t lighting up then you definitely need a new service manager. Has Jack all to do with the problem, if you can’t be constructive kiss off.

Simmer down there turbo!
I apologized in advance did u not read the whole post?. Dont get ur panties in a wad! Im 24yr service tech, I think im fine.
From your response there, sounds like u dont need the help, so way start the thread? Try using the search next time.
Sorry in advance again! 😘 and NoHomo

 

[CID]

I agree with you that the dual VM should still work even with primary battery on last legs. I will test the relay, it was a cheap fix to replace it which did nothing, but will check test it, when you say wiring is bad (was wired correctly and working for two years), do you mean problem with the ignition wire, as that’s kind of where I am headed with it now.

Since it worked for 2 years, I'd be looking at the connections used to wire it, maybe a loose crimp. I'd also check that the relay was seeing voltage when the key is on.

VMs have been known to go bad, so start by grounding the VM directly, it should light up.

Someone else's drawing, ground the terminal the orange arrow is pointing at -

 

[Remington]

Really ?? If you believe that a primary battery that is weak but needs replacement is the reason that a dual VM isn’t lighting up then you definitely need a new service manager. Has Jack all to do with the problem, if you can’t be constructive kiss off.

I was being nice and avoiding this, but POIDH
Of your rig. We haven't seen any from u yet.
Once you get your issue fixed.

Hope you fix it soon, getting worked up is bad for your overall health. Id start with that main battery upgrade then take my meeter , start tracing your voltage from the start of the relay and go from there till your voltage drops.
And yes, any weakness including your main battery as non constructive as it seems can cause issues in the circuit. See @CID above post.
Have a Blessed day sir! 😉

 

[gkozak]

I’ve seen batts that are so bad that they won’t show any voltage at all.

It depends on which side of the circuit is powering the VM. If the VM is being powered by the bad battery then yes it is possible that it’s not going to power on especially if the isolator isn’t pushing amps to it.

I would not have realized that. I will be replacing the battery anyhow as it needs to be replaced, thanks

 

[gkozak]

I was being nice and avoiding this, but POIDH
Of your rig. We haven't seen any from u yet.
Once you get your issue fixed.

Hope you fix it soon, getting worked up is bad for your overall health. Id start with that main battery upgrade then take my meeter , start tracing your voltage from the start of the relay and go from there till your voltage drops.
And yes, any weakness including your main battery as non constructive as it seems can cause issues in the circuit. See @CID above post.
Have a Blessed day sir! 😉

Yes, it is working me up, and that’s not healthy. I appreciate that wish for a blessed day and will strive for that.

 

[gkozak]

I was being nice and avoiding this, but POIDH
Of your rig. We haven't seen any from u yet.
Once you get your issue fixed.

Hope you fix it soon, getting worked up is bad for your overall health. Id start with that main battery upgrade then take my meeter , start tracing your voltage from the start of the relay and go from there till your voltage drops.
And yes, any weakness including your main battery as non constructive as it seems can cause issues in the circuit. See @CID above post.
Have a Blessed day sir! 😉

POIDH of my rig, amateur vid though. 📸 Look at this post on Facebook Honda Pioneer Riders | Check out my mods to my 1000-5 limited mostly handy accessories, for those interested in making some: | Facebook

 

[packer58]

@gkozak, you'll get solid information from some very knowledgeable members on this site .......BUT ...... it isn't free. The cost of doing business here is a bit of harshness and a dose of sarcasm, don't ask me how I know. When troubleshooting electrical systems it's a must that you have the basic test equipment ie: test light, multi-meter and a couple alligator clip jumper wires, work one circuit at a time and eliminate. don't guess and just start changing parts / components.

 

[bumperm]

I’ve seen batts that are so bad that they won’t show any voltage at all.

It depends on which side of the circuit is powering the VM. If the VM is being powered by the bad battery then yes it is possible that it’s not going to power on especially if the isolator isn’t pushing amps to it.

This is incorrect.

The isolator doesn't push amps to anything. It does, depending on conditions and voltage of each battery, connect the two batteries so they can share a common charging source. Also, to a point, it will allow one battery to "assist" the other that is under load, but if it is the main helping with aux load, it will stop helping in order to prevent over discharging of the main bat.

The dual voltmeter requires a ground. It also would need a + battery connected to one of it's two inputs with some reasonable voltage - - it would then display that voltage. If another battery is connected it would display that voltage. So long as there's a ground applied, either battery will light its respective display.

Thus, if you know one or more batteries are good, and both the voltmeter displays are off, then you would suspect the ground is bad. Note that most installs have the ground applied by a relay that is powered by key-on positive voltage. If for some reason the display is completely blank, then and easy troubleshooting step is to use a scrap of wire and apply ground to that meter input terminal.

 

[packer58]

This is incorrect.

If for some reason the display is completely blank, then and easy troubleshooting step is to use a scrap of wire and apply ground to that meter input terminal.

Well said as usual and easy to understand ...... Here's where the jumper wires I mentioned will come in handy ......