P700 No Power

[BRK]

Hope i didn't call it.

Please keep us updated!

Thanks, I will. Its gone in the shop next week.

 

[Admin]

 

[BRK]

I just can't believe that using it "easy" would cause a cam failure. Extended idle can cause several issues, but most riders have idle time or low rev time when riding and start and stop time. If this is a issues with the 700 motor, I can't believe that Honda has not done something about it in all the years this motor has been around. I've always heard this is a very reliable motor, no matter how you use it.... @swsebek says he has only heard of 1 issue in several years.
I will just do my service and keep good oil in it and valves checked and hope for the best..

I thought the same, the mechanic at the Honda dealer told me that he has had several of them in with the same issue, I still don't believe him, thats why im gonna do a compression test and check valve movement before I believe that.

 

[BRK]

Are you under warranty yet.??

No, honda only offers 1 year on these machines and I didn't take the extended warranty because the last time I did that it cost me about 1800.00 and they didn't cover alot of stuff.

 

[Smitty335]

No, honda only offers 1 year on these machines and I didn't take the extended warranty because the last time I did that it cost me about 1800.00 and they didn't cover alot of stuff.

Let us know what they found.

 

[Deluxe700]

No, honda only offers 1 year on these machines and I didn't take the extended warranty because the last time I did that it cost me about 1800.00 and they didn't cover alot of stuff.

Like @Smitty335 said..please let us know what the final solution turns out to be..

 

[BRK]

Let us know what they found.

i will, it is going into the shop this week.

 

[Pete]

I’ve had the first Big Red for 6 years and never touched the valves. My 700, however, had issues with valve adjustment. I waited too long to check not being aware of the issue. My camshaft was more like a broomstick. The cam is not the issue. It is what fails but the excessive gap contributes to the wear on the cam. With my new cam, I also changed to Mobil 1 4T Racing oil. It is a full synthetic without added friction modifiers. Hopefully it will help keep temps down as well as providing better lubricant.

 

[DG Rider]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record...

Its one of those things that amazes me. People get bent if you use anything but "special Honda oil", yet when you suggest they get the valves checked (which Honda specifically states you should do) they just kinda laugh it off. It's totally understandable how someone could assume they don't need to check them with whats posted all over facebook and web forums, but those places don't pay the repair bill for you.

Check the valves. Especially for the first service or 2.
With a feeler gauge...not your ear.
If a dealer "checks" your valves by "listening to it", find another dealer who understands how valvetrains work. Once the valve train settles in, it will probably stay put for many thousands of miles, so if you aren't having to adjust, its probably safe to skip to every other adjustment.

 

[DG Rider]

What's in the Shop: Rincon 680

 

[Pete]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record...

Its one of those things that amazes me. People get bent if you use anything but "special Honda oil", yet when you suggest they get the valves checked (which Honda specifically states you should do) they just kinda laugh it off. It's totally understandable how someone could assume they don't need to check them with whats posted all over facebook and web forums, but those places don't pay the repair bill for you.

Check the valves. Especially for the first service or 2.
With a feeler gauge...not your ear.
If a dealer "checks" your valves by "listening to it", find another dealer who understands how valvetrains work. Once the valve train settles in, it will probably stay put for many thousands of miles, so if you aren't having to adjust, its probably safe to skip to every other adjustment.

When a customer who isn’t necessarily a mechanic or for that matter any customer buys a new vehicle, given the reliability of the valve train in automobiles (hydraulic lifters?), I believe we should have been told about the periodic setting issue. I read more than the average person but had no knowledge of the valve/cam issue. But Honda knew. My dealer knew. Would have been beneficial and in the long term better for Honda if it was publicized obviously.

 

[DG Rider]

When a customer who isn’t necessarily a mechanic or for that matter any customer buys a new vehicle, given the reliability of the valve train in automobiles (hydraulic lifters?), I believe we should have been told about the periodic setting issue. I read more than the average person but had no knowledge of the valve/cam issue. But Honda knew. My dealer knew. Would have been beneficial and in the long term better for Honda if it was publicized obviously.

I agree 100%. Sadly, salesman tend to know little beyond the training videos they watch, and most techs/dealers have a devil may care attitude towards the procedure. It means less in and out for the shop, and less $$$. Add to that what I talked about with social media, and it's easy to see why people are suprised.

 

[500oneer]

Widespread probably is too strong a word, but it does happen on occasion. @Farmer is the most recent member i can recall. I think if you Google this it goes all the way back to the Rincon and seems to affect machines that idle a lot or are stop/started often. Like farm work.

Some have claimed the cam was updated, but it doesn't seem that way. Whats funny is that the cam sits in a little tray that holds oil, so it shouldn't ever dry start. This is reason #1 why I always checked the valves at the intervals in the manual.

That was my rincon. 3 cams in 9,000 miles. Farm use, not letting it warm up. Service manager said some cams in 2007 were bad. They did give me a second cam free,but after babying the rincon and 3rd cam went out l had enough. Thank god for the pioneer 500.

 

[DG Rider]

For the record, mine had just under 9000 on it when I sold it . No issues, but when it got started, it usually racked up 100 miles.

 

[Farmer]

Another thing is he has only 500 miles.. and Farmer is the only cam issue I can remember in almost 5 years and three forums.. and Farmers dealer told him it was a common issue for people the start and stop a lot.I believed it was just bad luck or a bad cam to begin with. I dont believe it was anything @Farmer was doing wrong.
It sounds more like the baffle collapse Or restricted in take.JMO

Sorry for the delayed reply here. I was up north fishing..

My 2014 cam went bad at about 680 miles. No lobes left at all. The dealer had all of the parts sitting on the shelf waiting for the next victim. They had done 3 or 4 of the 700 pioneers and a bunch of big reds. If I remember correctly they blamed it on farm use/alot of idling and a bad hardening process on the cams. Mine was replaced with a 2015 part# cam. Now I worry about it every time I drive it. Not fun.

Just becuase you don't hear about it on the forums doesn't mean it's not happening.

 

[swsebek]

Sorry for the delayed reply here. I was up north fishing..

My 2014 cam went bad at about 680 miles. No lobes left at all. The dealer had all of the parts sitting on the shelf waiting for the next victim. They had done 3 or 4 of the 700 pioneers and a bunch of big reds. If I remember correctly they blamed it on farm use/alot of idling and a bad hardening process on the cams. Mine was replaced with a 2015 part# cam. Now I worry about it every time I drive it. Not fun.

Just becuase you don't hear about it on the forums doesn't mean it's not happening.

I still don't believe it was anything you did wrong or your driving style... Bad hardening process sounds more believable.

i will, it is going into the shop this week.

Any news on this yet?

 

[Farmer]

I still don't believe it was anything you did wrong or your driving style... Bad hardening process sounds more believable.

Any news on this yet?

Agreed!

 

[BRK]

well Guys, it was the Cam, its gonna cost me 1800.00 for parts and labor, I had 2 different guys take a look at it, 1 guy I trusted real well, and they both told me it was the Cam, I can fix it myself for about 175.00, the cost of the cam. I don't know where the dealers get there price estimates at ???? I may have to buy new lifters and the cam bearing as well, but they are very inexpensive.

 

[tundraman]

When looking to upgrade to a 1000 I told my dealer my 700 was so reliable and didn't know how reliable a 1000 would be. He told me what I already knew, that the 700s can have cam problems. I have always used mobile 1 t4 oil and my machine has been started 1000s of times. The problem as I have stated before is winter starts and short trips. Condensate builds up in the oil and you need longer trips to burn it off. My bike runs as good as ever with 500 hours and 2600 miles and a lot of idle time. I just make sure in the winter to do some extended riding once in a while and it's not so bad as I got a windshield last winter.

 

[DG Rider]

well Guys, it was the Cam, its gonna cost me 1800.00 for parts and labor, I had 2 different guys take a look at it, 1 guy I trusted real well, and they both told me it was the Cam, I can fix it myself for about 175.00, the cost of the cam. I don't know where the dealers get there price estimates at ???? I may have to buy new lifters and the cam bearing as well, but they are very inexpensive.

Well...that sucks.
Lifters are mandatory...You will find they are chewed up as well.
My concern would be where did all that metal go? I'd pop the filter And see if there is enough to make up 2 cam lobes or otherwise I'd want to clean the pickup screen as well.

 

[DG Rider]

Oh...and i meant to put it In my post about my milage...but mine went to synthetic oil at the 1st service, and never had anything but.