P1000 814 UTV Shocks

[Alaska350]

Ok so I am ready to pull the trigger on a set of shocks from 814 but would like some feedback first. I use my pioneer for trail riding mainly for camping and pleasure but have added a lot of weight to the factory shocks with my mods and they seem to struggle.

• There are 2 versions available for my pioneer 1000….trail series and 3 way series. Which is everyone using for normal riding and why? I do not drive aggressively due to my dogs always being in the back.
• With the weight of all my mods (300ish Ibs), my weight (200ish Ibs) and my 2 German shepherds weight (160ish Ibs) I feel like I will need alot stronger springs. This is just the normal additional weight to the stock suspension sees on a day trip and does it does not cover camping gear or extra gas. So with that said what spring specs should I be asking for? And can they do that?
• The site mentions the shocks will not work with bracket lifts but nothing about high clearance forward a-arms. I have installed front and back super Atv ones. Is there gonna be a issue with axle binding with the 1.5” of forward movement and what ever lift comes with the shocks? What is the lift they give you? The site doesn’t even say a specific list measurement.
• Does anyone have a discount code? I know this shocks are a good deal but shipping to Alaska has added a hefty shipping fee.

Thanks guys!

 

[Admin]

 

[P1K5Dave]

814 used to be a cheaper alternative to fox/walker/elka. The price has gone up to the point that there's not much savings.

Since they don't have internal limiters, they rely on limit straps that mount shoddily on the outside, which will require a few trips to the hardware store to figure out. Plan on a box of washers to deal with spacing.

If you want to put as much preload on them as most guys do, the limit straps will kill your articulation.

I ran them for a few weeks, took a loss and sold them to one of the FB fanbois, then got some Foxes.

 

[JoeyL]

IDK about the 814's but when i ordered my Elkas they have a form where you fill out details about how your machine is loaded. They use that to come up w your spring rate for your load case.
So I would call them and see if you can order a set with springs set up properly for your load case. Or just get elkas

and you are right, the way you are loaded you will need heavier springs than a stock machine

 

[Robobrainiac]

I found this seller on ebay who seems like a good guy. I was able to get my take off fox shocks for a sweet deal. I have noticed he goes in and out of stock so you have to catch them while you can and send him an offer.

If you use the search function you can find some information on spring rate. I went with 250lbs for the front and 300 for the rear. I should hopefully have everything installed in a couple of weeks.

P1000m5 - Fox shocks: Guidance on a good purchase I made

I just purchased these for my 2020 pioneer 1000-5 and as far as I know they should fit and work well just the rate is different from the 3 seater to the 5 seater. I plan on changing springs either way if I had I purchased new or not. These are supposed to be new open box. I made an offer of $900...

hondasxs.com

 

[PJon]

I’m running the 814 three ways on my P1k5 and so far so good. I’m only running 28” tires so I haven’t needed the forward arms. The 814’s are shipped with 350# front and 400# rear springs. I’ve moved the 350# springs to the rear and run Eibach’s 300# springs on the front. They’re about $70 each from Summit Racing.

 

[Alaska350]

Ok Next question. Do any other shocks come with a lift build in like the 814s?

 

[Robobrainiac]

Ok Next question. Do any other shocks come with a lift build in like the 814s?

ALL adjustable shocks come with "lift" in the form of how you set your pre tension.

Basically the more pre load you add (turning the top coil ring) the stiffer you make the coil spring by compressing it more and that generates lift in the form of making the coil spring stiffer.

If you make it too tight you will have reduced ride comfort because you are essentially creating a stiffer spring and lowering the stroke available to the shaft of the shock. Too much pre load can potentially create a harsh ride.

Ride quality is subjective like taste. What one person thinks is smooth another person may thing it's not smooth enough.

The science behind shocks can get confusing if you aren't ready for it. Otherwise to simply answer your question, ALL adjustable shocks can create lift. The 814 is no different than Fox or Elka in terms of lift generated by pre load.

I hope that makes sense.

 

[PJon]

Ok Next question. Do any other shocks come with a lift build in like the 814s?

The 814’s don’t actually have built in lift. It’s the springs and the pre load that can be put on them that give you the lift. The Fox, Walker-Evans and Elka’s all have this capability. The bracket lift kits essentially do the same thing by repositioning the top shock mounts. The limiting factor with any type of lift is the angle that the axle cv joints can take without binding.

 

[Robobrainiac]

I don't know if this will help but basically the top of this shock where the silver area is located is threaded. So if I turn the black ring on top of the red coil one way or the other I can loosen and tighten the coil. The tighter I make the coil the taller the machine will sit. The looser I make the coil the lower the machine will sit.

This applies to Elka, 814, Fox, Walker Evans and most all adjustable shock companies.

For best ride quality results you want 20%-30% of sag. When the vehicle weight is placed onto the shock you want it to compress 20%-30% of the length of the shock.

 

[Robobrainiac]

Trying to keep it simple when it comes to shocks can be difficult.

 

[PJon]

@Alaska350, as you have already installed the SATV A-arms on your machine, you can go to 30” tires and get some additional lift. Because of the increased diameter, your overall gearing will be higher, so you’ll be putting more strain on your clutch pack if you’re into rock crawling or other types of rough very slow terrain. BTW, you’ve got a good looking machine.

 

[P1K5Dave]

Technically, adjusting the preload does nothing to "stiffen" the spring, it just changes ride height. It does change ride characteristics, however.

Bracket lifts actually have a detrimental effect on ride quality because they shift the upper shock outward (more vertical.)

The ideal angle for a shock is 45 degrees, but most vehicles are unable to attain this as a design factor. You see some buggys with shocks sticking out of the hood - they're getting closer to that ideal.

 

[Alaska350]

@Alaska350, as you have already installed the SATV A-arms on your machine, you can go to 30” tires and get some additional lift. Because of the increased diameter, your overall gearing will be higher, so you’ll be putting more strain on your clutch pack if you’re into rock crawling or other types of rough very slow terrain. BTW, you’ve got a good looking machine.

Thanks! I have 29” on it but will go down a size since there is a lot of slow riding here in Alaska that is not smooth. I wouldnt say I rock climb but bumpy rocky trails are the norm here. I am wanting to upgrade the shocks to increase load capacity in the front and back. I have a front hitch that I installed a hitch carrier rack for gas cans and a ice chest. In the back I have the weight of the canopy and 2 big dogs……so add that with the bigger tires and it make the tires hit the fenders way more than I’d like.

 

[PJon]

Thanks! I have 29” on it but will go down a size since there is a lot of slow riding here in Alaska that is not smooth. I wouldnt say I rock climb but bumpy rocky trails are the norm here. I am wanting to upgrade the shocks to increase load capacity in the front and back. I have a front hitch that I installed a hitch carrier rack for gas cans and a ice chest. In the back I have the weight of the canopy and 2 big dogs……so add that with the bigger tires and it make the tires hit the fenders way more than I’d like.

That being the case, it sounds like you are not doing a lot of riding in technical areas where you really have to watch your clutch slippage. Go with which ever shocks are adjustable and don’t use progressive springs. You can probably get the ride and height you want with 300# rear springs and 250 or 275# front springs. Then just adjust the spring pre tension to get the height you’d like. I have mine adjusted so that the installed length of the shocks is eye to eye 18” with my junk in it. You’ll probably get a bit better ride by using 17”-17-1/2” on yours with the larger tires. It all depends on the ride quality you like for the ground clearance your type of riding requires. When adjusting the pre tension, take all of the weight off the corner you’re working on and be sure to use anti seize on the spring adjustment rings during assembly.

 

[Alaska350]

That being the case, it sounds like you are not doing a lot of riding in technical areas where you really have to watch your clutch slippage. Go with which ever shocks are adjustable and don’t use progressive springs. You can probably get the ride and height you want with 300# rear springs and 250 or 275# front springs. Then just adjust the spring pre tension to get the height you’d like. I have mine adjusted so that the installed length of the shocks is eye to eye 18” with my junk in it. You’ll probably get a bit better ride by using 17”-17-1/2” on yours with the larger tires. It all depends on the ride quality you like for the ground clearance your type of riding requires. When adjusting the pre tension, take all of the weight off the corner you’re working on and be sure to use anti seize on the spring adjustment rings during assembly.

Do you recommend a shock brand?

 

[PJon]

Do you recommend a shock brand?

After reading a lot of posts here, the most popular appear to be Fox and Elka. Walker Evans are similar in that all 3 have one adjustment knob mounted on a remote reservoir. The 814’s don’t have the single knob or the remote reservoir but do have individual adjustments for compression, rebound and on the 3-ways another adjustment to control how the shock reacts to rapid movements. The 814’s also have limit straps so that they won’t extend past their 21” stroke and cause internal damage to the shock. 814 shock straps limit stroke to 19”. The stock Honda shocks have a stroke of 20”. I think you’ll have CV binding if the suspension goes past that 20” limit unless you have axles with more internal angle limits. I’d go with whatever system is the lowest price and has the best delivery. Keep in mind that you won’t like the progressive rate (multi rate or dual rate) springs that come on the Fox shocks from Honda. From what I’ve read they are dual rate springs and you’ll use up all of the lower capacity and spring length quickly and be only riding on the higher rate portion, especially on the rear. You should read P1K5Dave’s Build. He has a good article on springs and how to install and set up.

 

[mlynch001]

Using Excessive pre-load to get static ride height increases is the wrong thing to do. IF the unit "sags' excessively when adding weight to the machine, adding a huge amount preload is not the cure. Spring rates must be selected properly to set the DESIRED static ride height and then preload adjusted minimally to set desired ride height sag or "loaded ride height". These two numbers are not the same, properly set up, the machine should sag a little bit when all the cargo is added. Typically about 1 inch of preload should be all that is needed, that is IF the spring RATE selected is in the ball park.. If, upon adding the cargo to the machine, the ride height drops say 3-4 inches, then the spring selected is too low a rate and rate should be increased. Yes, you might be able add in a bunch of preload and get the ride height back with load, but the spring is still too soft and the damper system will not react properly over all types of bumps. Preload is a "fine tuning" adjustment, not a "fix" for a spring that is "too soft" or "too hard". When you add excess preload to a "soft" spring for ride height compensation, you will still have a damper that will require excessive compression adjustments and to try to stop the bottoming out of the soft springs. The typical result of this setup is a damper and suspension that bottoms out over big bumps and is harsh and choppy over small bumps. And this still does not deal with the effects of excessive preload on the rebound side of the system. Bottom line is that there is no such thing as a "one spring rate fits all' solution, your shock supplier needs to select a spring RATE that will support your static loads and cargo without excessive preload being required.

 

[Alaska350]

I’m running the 814 three ways on my P1k5 and so far so good. I’m only running 28” tires so I haven’t needed the forward arms. The 814’s are shipped with 350# front and 400# rear springs. I’ve moved the 350# springs to the rear and run Eibach’s 300# springs on the front. They’re about $70 each from Summit Racing.

I can’t find these numbers posted in their site to confirm this. Where did you find these specs? And what does stock plain Jane shocks come with?

 

[PJon]

I can’t find these numbers posted in their site to confirm this. Where did you find these specs? And what does stock plain Jane shocks come with?

When I ordered the shocks, they wouldn’t tell me the spring rates. However, upon arrival, the spring rates are printed on the springs. @DDDonkey did a video on his a couple of years ago and I believe he stated that his at that time were the same spring rates. You can check out his builds on YouTube Dirt N Diesel

 

[Jaked2694]

Can someone help me with my 814s my rear springs. Trying to get to 18.5 eye to eye but I’m almost 3/4 up on tightening the shock and don’t know if that’s normal. Have super atv offset arms and 28” tires. To me it just doesn’t seem right