P1000 Clutches...

[Plongson]

Here's my update on clutches, transmission and shifting...

After 300 miles the P-5 is shifting amazing, very smooth. What is most noticeable is the clutch engagement from dead stop/idle to easing on the throttle. Absolutely no shudder. There is NO jerky/grabby engagement anymore. It will actually feather as if you are feathering it with a manual clutch. Using the same common sense you would have with a manual clutch, I can't see where there would be a problem with wear. It's sure nice to not have that "drop the clutch GRAB" if you just want to take off easy.

On the other hand, it you stomp on it from an idle, it immediately grabs and takes off. Somewhere I read where the system "learns and adapts" to your personal driving habits. So far it has learned mine and I love it.

 

[Admin]

 

[lrandy129]

Good deal! How's it shift in low-range? Mine is smooth in High, but Low reminds me of a TH350 with a head snapping shift kit installed.

 

[Crow_Hunter]

Here's my update on clutches, transmission and shifting...

After 300 miles the P-5 is shifting amazing, very smooth. What is most noticeable is the clutch engagement from dead stop/idle to easing on the throttle. Absolutely no shudder. There is NO jerky/grabby engagement anymore. It will actually feather as if you are feathering it with a manual clutch. Using the same common sense you would have with a manual clutch, I can't see where there would be a problem with wear. It's sure nice to not have that "drop the clutch GRAB" if you just want to take off easy.

On the other hand, it you stomp on it from an idle, it immediately grabs and takes off. Somewhere I read where the system "learns and adapts" to your personal driving habits. So far it has learned mine and I love it.

2016 or 2017?

I don't really notice shifts in Hi range but Low range I definitely do. I also have 300 miles on mine and the shudder has recently gotten more noticeable on mine. Before, mine was only doing it starting on a hill, now mine does it starting off on flat ground.

Sounds like you got one of the good ones.

 

[elkguide]

Good deal! How's it shift in low-range? Mine is smooth in High, but Low reminds me of a TH350 with a head snapping shift kit installed.

Mine was great in high but when I went to low I had some head snapping shifts but after a ten minute "teach me to shift in low range" session, all is well now with mine.

 

[Plongson]

It's a 2016 w/300 miles. Whether low or high range, if you ease on the throttle it will pull away SMOOTH. With just a bit of rapid throttle action it grabs and goes...essentially, smooth when you ease it on and "grab and GO!" when you hammer it.

Real happy with so far...

 

[lrandy129]

Mine takes off smooth in H or L as well as Reverse and the only slippage when you mat the throttle is the tires spinning. I hadn't given the hard shifts in Low much thought until I noticed my lab thrown off balance when a couple of downshifts caught her off guard. Took a few rides, but she has it down now.

 

[JTW]

Mine was smooth until they went out...

 

[Crow_Hunter]

Mine was smooth until they went out...

Seriously?!?! Or are you just joking around? Did your clutches go out as well?

 

[JTW]

Seriously?!?! Or are you just joking around? Did your clutches go out as well?

Yeah.. long story but yes.

 

[Plongson]

Huh...Were you the cause of the failure or was Honda? Be honest... )

 

[JTW]

Huh...Were you the cause of the failure or was Honda? Be honest... )

Let me put it like this... these things not having an emergency brake will eventually get someone killed! No, it wasn't my fault.

 

[Eltobgi]

Let me put it like this... these things not having an emergency brake will eventually get someone killed! No, it wasn't my fault.

Well Damn! Now you have to tell the story

 

[JTW]

So as I haven't had my warranty work completed yet, I didn't want to say too much publicly that might be misconstrued and used against me, but screw it. It really needs to be said.... So, long story short. We had to go up a ridiculously bad hill of which we had to stop and winch up the last bit. I had a brake line fail before they could get me hooked up. This was an oh s*** moment to the fullest.... back wasn't an option! I had no other choice than to use my throttle to help hold me as the peddle hit the floor. Had it had an e-brake like the p500 or p700 or any other reasonable off-road machine that weighs 2000+ lbs, it wouldn't have happened. I'll say this though... I had less than 10 seconds before the clutch went. Truthfully, if it hadn't happened then, I think it would have eventually. I fully understand the clutch issues and how they should be driven. And honestly it was doing fine. But I think they'll all eventually fail before they should. It may be 20 years and 20,000 miles but realistically, when driven properly, they should last longer than that and they shouldn't fail the way they are. I think the clutch heated up and the friction material delaminated, end of story. But the fact is, they need a damn emergency brake! This is crazy not to! That's 2 machines I know of, in less than a month time, that really needed that emergency brake for EXACTLY what it's intended use is!

 

[Crow_Hunter]

So as I haven't had my warranty work completed yet, I didn't want to say too much publicly that might be misconstrued and used against me, but screw it. It really needs to be said.... So, long story short. We had to go up a ridiculously bad hill of which we had to stop and winch up the last bit. I had a brake line fail before they could get me hooked up. This was an oh s*** moment to the fullest.... back wasn't an option! I had no other choice than to use my throttle to help hold me as the peddle hit the floor. Had it had an e-brake like the p500 or p700 or any other reasonable off-road machine that weighs 2000+ lbs, it wouldn't have happened. I'll say this though... I had less than 10 seconds before the clutch went. Truthfully, if it hadn't happened then, I think it would have eventually. I fully understand the clutch issues and how they should be driven. And honestly it was doing fine. But I think they'll all eventually fail before they should. It may be 20 years and 20,000 miles but realistically, when driven properly, they should last longer than that and they shouldn't fail the way they are. I think the clutch heated up and the friction material delaminated, end of story. But the fact is, they need a damn emergency brake! This is crazy not to! That's 2 machines I know of, in less than a month time, that really needed that emergency brake for EXACTLY what it's intended use is!

Dammit man. Glad no one was hurt. Sorry you had such trouble.

That is really disappointing that it takes no more than that to cook the clutches. Yes, I know you aren't supposed to use it to hold on a hill but we had an old POS Mazda manual transmission truck at the garage that I worked at in HS/college. We used it to go and pick up customer vehicle and to make deliveries. The shop was on the court square which was on a hill. All roads leading to it required you to stop and wait on a steep hill to get into traffic. Since I don't have 3 feet, I know several times I started off and had to hold it on the hill with the clutch for a few seconds because some jackleg pulled out in front of me and on top of all of us driving it were HS/college age dimwits who were undoubted effing around with it. (I know I did) We never had to replace the clutch in the 2 years I worked there and we used the little truck multiple times a day...

There is something not right about how they have implemented this DCT. I tend to agree it is heat related. The Africa Twin doesn't have any problems with this DCT and is apparently the transmission of choice according to their forums. But it is lighter and moves faster on average and thus likely has more air flow/better oil cooling.

I agree completely on needing a separate parking brake independent of the main brake system. That is a design flaw that seems to be common on most of the big name SXS out there (but the Chinese knockoffs seem to have).

Hope you don't have any trouble getting it fixed.

 

[Eltobgi]

So as I haven't had my warranty work completed yet, I didn't want to say too much publicly that might be misconstrued and used against me, but screw it. It really needs to be said.... So, long story short. We had to go up a ridiculously bad hill of which we had to stop and winch up the last bit. I had a brake line fail before they could get me hooked up. This was an oh s*** moment to the fullest.... back wasn't an option! I had no other choice than to use my throttle to help hold me as the peddle hit the floor. Had it had an e-brake like the p500 or p700 or any other reasonable off-road machine that weighs 2000+ lbs, it wouldn't have happened. I'll say this though... I had less than 10 seconds before the clutch went. Truthfully, if it hadn't happened then, I think it would have eventually. I fully understand the clutch issues and how they should be driven. And honestly it was doing fine. But I think they'll all eventually fail before they should. It may be 20 years and 20,000 miles but realistically, when driven properly, they should last longer than that and they shouldn't fail the way they are. I think the clutch heated up and the friction material delaminated, end of story. But the fact is, they need a damn emergency brake! This is crazy not to! That's 2 machines I know of, in less than a month time, that really needed that emergency brake for EXACTLY what it's intended use is!

Oh s***!!! Glad you are OK! Also...Hoping you have some pictures to share! I know, I know, after all this...this selfish prick is asking for pictures! Lol
The more I think about it, the steel brake lines may be the way to go! Damn dude you could have been killed! Thanks for sharing!

 

[lrandy129]

Glad you weren't hurt! What caused the brake line failure? Snag it on something or mfg defect or ?

 

[JTW]

Oh s***!!! Glad you are OK! Also...Hoping you have some pictures to share! I know, I know, after all this...this selfish prick is asking for pictures! Lol
The more I think about it, the steel brake lines may be the way to go! Damn dude you could have been killed! Thanks for sharing!

No pics of any of it... we were all too busy trying to get up the hill as storms were about to roll thru. I wish I had a garmin camera to show the severity of it.

 

[JTW]

Glad you weren't hurt! What caused the brake line failure? Snag it on something or mfg defect or ?

Can't say... I have braided stainless lines coming so I'm not concerned about Honda fixing them. Really it's a big reason I haven't already had it in the shop. Im busy as it is, so sense in going thru fixing the lines just to replace them and have to re-bleed etc. The whole thing is really just a testimate to how s*** happens and an off-road machine needs a mechanical e-brake AND to give some actual clutch failure info. I grew up on manual clutches and a machine SHOULD be able to hold itself for a long time before failing. This was just a matter of seconds!

 

[elkguide]

Hope that things come together for you quickly JT.

 

[JACKAL]

So as I haven't had my warranty work completed yet, I didn't want to say too much publicly that might be misconstrued and used against me, but screw it. It really needs to be said.... So, long story short. We had to go up a ridiculously bad hill of which we had to stop and winch up the last bit. I had a brake line fail before they could get me hooked up. This was an oh s*** moment to the fullest.... back wasn't an option! I had no other choice than to use my throttle to help hold me as the peddle hit the floor. Had it had an e-brake like the p500 or p700 or any other reasonable off-road machine that weighs 2000+ lbs, it wouldn't have happened. I'll say this though... I had less than 10 seconds before the clutch went. Truthfully, if it hadn't happened then, I think it would have eventually. I fully understand the clutch issues and how they should be driven. And honestly it was doing fine. But I think they'll all eventually fail before they should. It may be 20 years and 20,000 miles but realistically, when driven properly, they should last longer than that and they shouldn't fail the way they are. I think the clutch heated up and the friction material delaminated, end of story. But the fact is, they need a damn emergency brake! This is crazy not to! That's 2 machines I know of, in less than a month time, that really needed that emergency brake for EXACTLY what it's intended use is!

Sounds like the last 1/3rd of Trail 26. That is a serious spot when muddy like it was. I can definitely see that happening with a failed brake line. Those switchback are a 42 degrees incline. I got on it like that in a P500 and it cold barely crawl it up in first gear, just stalled in 2nd.