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Multi Field Stripping a Tie Rod

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by lee, Feb 5, 2016.

  1. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    Does your tie rod look like this?
    Thought you would customize your Pioneers looks on an old stump?
    upload_2016-2-5_23-16-10.png

    In case you where wondering, it is supposed to look like this:
    upload_2016-2-5_23-16-39.png

    This guide is intended to help you get on your way, it is not a copy of the official factory service manual. Be carful working with tools and under the vehicle, if you are not sure about doing any of this take it to a trained professional and have it done right. I will share the tips and tricks I know But to be honest they are mostly my ‘guys’ tricks, he has years of experience working on dirt bikes, ATVs and SxS.

    And, since I’m being super honest about all this, the bent tie rod is not mine and I didn’t bend it. I took the picture while pumping gas, this person was on the other side filling up at the same time. So as not to be a jerk and embarrass @JACKAL I’m not going to name names.
     
    #1 lee, Feb 5, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 5, 2016
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  2. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    Starters:

    1)The tie rods between the Pioneer models is the same except for the length (as far as I can tell from the parts fiche). Removal and installation will be similar.
    2)You don’t need to memorize all the steps now, you don’t even need to read it all, just remember that this post exists and you can look it up when you need it – hopefully you will have cell reception half way down the mountain when you pretzelize your tie rod.
    3)The tie rods are not left / right so if you only need to carry one as a spare, or steal one off a donor SxS to get you back to camp. Again this is from a parts fiche.

    Room to Work

    Loosen the lug nuts and get the tire in the air (jack or hang it off a log). Make sure the vehicle is stable because you are going to be pushing on it pretty hard. Take the tire off to make room to work.

    Removing the tie rod end (wheel side).

    This step is sort of optional but it makes life easier if you can remove it. I have a ball joint tool from maintaining a fleet of Honda cars.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-18-43.png
     
    #2 lee, Feb 5, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2016
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  3. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    Remove the cotter pin and loosen the nut, 17mm wrench. I leave the nut on but unscrew it so the tool is pushing on the nut. In case something gets messed up the nut is easy to replace. Also, now is the time to loosen the jamb nut locking the tie rod end to the tie rod, 19mm wrench.

    I forgot to take a picture of this operation so I threw the ball joint tool on the Odyssey to show how it fits. Finger on the bottom pushes the tapered stud up when you tighten the bolt. It lets go with a bang.

    Now you can unscrew the tie rod end.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-19-36.png

    There are other methods to remove a tapered stud tie rod end that you can find on the net. I have tried several with varying degrees of un-needed expense. A ‘pickle fork’ will get it off but I always destroy the boot. I tried the ‘2 hammer’ method once and chipped the steering arm on the knuckle (don’t try it if the knuckle is cast iron (in fact don’t try this at all)).

    Plan B – leave the tie rod end attached to the knuckle

    You might be able to loosen the jamb nut (19mm wrench) and rotate the tie rod to unscrew it from the end with out removing the end from the knuckle. If this looks easier give it a try, if the tie rod is bent too much it may not turn all the way around in which case you will need to remove the tie rod end from the knuckle.
     
    #3 lee, Feb 5, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2016
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  4. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    Remove das Boot

    How many of you saw that movie in the original German language with sub titles? It was freaky when the only English you heard was from guys the sub crew was machine gunning and you weren't quite sure who to cheer for. Like mini Stockholm syndrome from watching the world from the U-boat perspective.

    Anyway, the outer clip is removed with pliers, it is just one of those spring hose clamps. Squeeze the tabs together and slid it out of the way.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-21-53.png

    Hot Tip: To get the boot out of the grove in the tie rod stick a small screwdriver in between the boot and the tie rod and move it around in a circle while applying pressure to slide the boot off. You just need to get the boot started out of the groove it is mounted in.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-22-16.png

    Reassembly tip: when you reassemble the boot put a little grease in the groove (both inner and outer) to make sure the boot seals. The boot is plastic and might leak otherwise.
     
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  5. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    The inner end of the boot has a CV joint band on it. On mine the crimp was on the back side and I could not get to it. Use channel locks or vice grips to rotate the band until you have access to the crimp.

    I used a punch to stretch the crimp out then unhook the band. Didn't think to take a picture until after the deed was done, but you get the idea.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-23-11.png

    Hot Tip: When replacing the band use Honda part # 95018-46250, BAND, AIR CLEANER CONNECTING TUBE (46). This band is easy to put on and take off for next time!

    upload_2016-2-5_23-23-41.png

    Some aftermarket steering racks use zip ties, and I have seen people use worm drive hose clamps. These are not recommended with the plastic boot. They can leave a gap for dirt / water to get in. As a temporary measure I have a zip tie holding mine together until Amazon delivers the clamp. The air cleaner band is made to seal all the way around to keep dirt out of the engine, good enough for a steering rack.


    Reassembly tip: remember to put a little grease in the groove between the boot and the steering rack body to make sure the boot seals.
     
    #5 lee, Feb 5, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2016
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  6. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    Unscrew the inner end of the tie rod

    Use a 32mm wrench to unscrew the inner socket joint. What no 32mm wrench? Me neither, I broke in to the tractor tools and found a 1 ¼” open end that fit just right. In a pinch a pair of vice grips will do. If you have a large crescent wrench it may fit but the space is a little tight.

    It unscrews like a normal bolt – but it is hard to get started – put your foot on it.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-26-3.png

    There is a locking washer keeping the inner socket joint from coming lose. The washer is punched in to notches in the socket joint (red arrow) and there are tabs that fit in to the rack end (green arrow).
    upload_2016-2-5_23-26-24.png
     
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  7. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    End of the rack showing the notches the tabs fit in to.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-27-0.png

    Reassembly tip: When you screw the socket joint back on punch the lock washer to make it lock. On mine I was punching almost the same spot as the factory punch mark.

    Also, I heard that the little tabs often get ripped off on disassembly. They are cheap, order a few when you order your parts.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-27-26.png
     
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  8. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    Reassemble the tie rod end. Set the toe, you can count how many turns to remove the tie rod end and get a rough setting from that.

    Reinstall the cotter pin, mount the wheel and your good to go.
    upload_2016-2-5_23-28-4.png

    Wow this got long. Wonder if I could get a job writing the official accessory installation instructions?

    The End
    upload_2016-2-5_23-28-27.png
     
    #8 lee, Feb 5, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2016
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  9. JACKAL

    JACKAL Ancient Guru
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    @lee That is good write up. love the submarine movie reference. You are right on about the washer, the little tabs all but ripped off when I removed mine. Aslo note the 1 1/4" wrench fits so tight you will swear it is too small but it does fit at a perfect angle, I used vise grip to loosen my bent tie rod after I was sure my $23 wrench I just bought would not fit. Very tight in there.

    20160206_145200.jpg 20160206_145221.jpg 20160206_145229.jpg
     
    #9 JACKAL, Feb 5, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2016
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  10. Hondasxs

    Hondasxs Club Founder
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    No... Because you did not require the dash to be removed!

    Otherwise, Thanks for the write up.
    But.. I dont know a single person with a ball joint separator. So plan B for that.
     
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  11. lee

    lee Adapt-o-fit hillbilly engineering done here
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    And that is why I included plan B.
    I came so close to throwing that thing in last weekend...
     
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  12. JACKAL

    JACKAL Ancient Guru
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  13. JACKAL

    JACKAL Ancient Guru
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    @lee Here is several detailed pictures I took removing my tie rod today, in case you want to substitute any in the above. Thank god for chain hoist I don't want to ever lie down in the mud to get one off. Wasn't bad at all standing up getting to it.
    20160206_132728.jpg 20160206_132745.jpg 20160206_132801.jpg 20160206_132819.jpg 20160206_132940.jpg 20160206_133018.jpg 20160206_135110.jpg 20160206_135138.jpg 20160206_135234.jpg 20160206_135317.jpg 20160206_135522.jpg 20160206_135648.jpg 20160206_135753.jpg 20160206_135806.jpg 20160206_144625.jpg 20160206_144954.jpg 20160206_145200.jpg
     
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  14. PioneerPete

    PioneerPete Well-Known Member
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    How did you bend the tie rod @JACKAL ?
     
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  15. JACKAL

    JACKAL Ancient Guru
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    Driving like @jak9922
     
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  16. joeymt33

    joeymt33 Is summer over yet!?
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    Did something hit the tire rod? Or did your tire hit a rock or stump or something else which caused the bend?
     
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  17. PioneerPete

    PioneerPete Well-Known Member
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    Understand... don't follow @jak9922 on the group ride!lol
     
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  18. jak9922

    jak9922 drives a p5 cuz i cant handle a 1k
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    Hahahah ;)
     
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  19. PioneerPete

    PioneerPete Well-Known Member
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    I sense that there are some things not being said here.... :rolleyes:
     
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  20. jak9922

    jak9922 drives a p5 cuz i cant handle a 1k
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    If only ppl knew half the nonsence we delete @JACKAL lol or hes just say i ride the p5 like its a 250r
     
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